Bellini hydrophen

derek andrews · Oct 20, 2017

Hi, I'm still endeavouring to get a good set of negs from kentmere 100 and have been advised to try it in Bellini Hydrophen, but no mention of this product is given in 'the massive dev chart' Any advice would be appreciated....again!

Svenedin · Oct 20, 2017

I’ve never heard of it. Didn’t you use Rodinal and you were unhappy with the grain? Why don’t you use a standard fine grain developer like ID-11 (or Xtol or any of the other readily available ones)?

MattKing · Oct 20, 2017

Did that advice come from Italy, perchance?
Are you in Italy, perchance?
Otherwise, I would suggest that you use one of the developers that the manufacturer gives times for: https://www.ilfordphoto.com/amfile/file/download/file_id/2022/product_id/696/

AgX · Oct 21, 2017

derek andrews said:
Hi, I'm still endeavouring to get a good set of negs from kentmere 100 and have been advised to try it in Bellini Hydrophen, but no mention of this product is given in 'the massive dev chart' Any advice would be appreciated....again!

Bellini products, even the firm itself, are hardly known even here at Apug.

Anon Ymous · Oct 21, 2017

Svenedin said:
... Why don’t you use a standard fine grain developer like ID-11 (or Xtol or any of the other readily available ones)?

Agreed. I'd try ID11/D76 first. Development times can be found in the datasheet that MattKing linked to previously.

twelvetone12 · Oct 21, 2017

I read some good reviews of Hydrophen (in Italian...). It seems a solvent PQ developer, but Bellini products are really had to get out of Italy it seems.

Ian Grant · Oct 21, 2017

Given that Ilford recommend 9min for Kentmere 100 in ID-11 stock at box speed and 8,5 mins for FP4+ just adjust the time in the Italian developer slightly FP4 is 3 mins 30 second so give 3mins 45 second for the Kentmere. However those time are to short for accurate B&W processing.

Ian

Svenedin · Oct 21, 2017

The OP developed his Kentmere 100 in rodinal and posted a thread on that. He was unhappy with the grain which is unsurprising since rodinal is not a fine grain developer. He said he had re-started developing after a long break. Then he started another thread about using microphen but it does not appear he tried that. He had another thread on scanning and we know that grain can sometimes be more prominent when negatives are scanned than when wet printed. I think there may be a quest going on for a magic bullet developer after one result that did not match expectations. It really would be far more sensible to try a standard developer, with standard times, as recommended by the film manufacturer before even contemplating obscure developers.

The bottom line is the OP may not like Kentmere 100 whatever he does with it but we don't know that yet. Just try some ID-11.......

Svenedin · Oct 21, 2017

MattKing said:
Did that advice come from Italy, perchance?
Are you in Italy, perchance?
Otherwise, I would suggest that you use one of the developers that the manufacturer gives times for: https://www.ilfordphoto.com/amfile/file/download/file_id/2022/product_id/696/

He's in Lancashire in the UK.

Chris Livsey · Oct 21, 2017

Svenedin said:
He's in Lancashire in the UK.

We're very cosmopolitan up here I'll have you know

I don't see a reason to go all exotic with the Kentmere, i don't shoot a lot of it but have no issues with a mix of developers:

HC110 1:60 12mins

Pyrocat HD1:1:100 15mins

Does the OP have expectations above what the film can deliver? It's more of a conventional emulsion and isn't going to look like Delta100, I find the the grain is pleasant but it's not Acros or as I say Delta I find the Kentmere 400 more useful but then I find any 400 film more useful.
Perhaps Acros 100 would be finer and meet expectations:

All these on 35mm various lenses and bodies above using TD-201 developer a bit cosmopolitan for Lancashire this frame from Lancaster.

Svenedin · Oct 21, 2017

Chris Livsey said:
We're very cosmopolitan up here I'll have you know

I don't doubt it. I have been "Up North" you know........I may be reluctant to go North of the Thames but I have done so on occasion . Nice to see you still have proper glass milk bottles delivered. Our milkman now delivers in awful plastic things. Interestingly, I think I can see grain on those bottles.

I also find 400 film vastly more useful in the UK. In my case HP5 or TMax 400. We live at a relatively high latitude in the UK (London being 51.5 degrees North and your part of the country probably about 54 degrees North). I am regularly in Gibraltar which is 36 degrees North. This makes a huge difference. Even an overcast day is much brighter.

Chris Livsey · Oct 21, 2017

Svenedin said:
I don't doubt it. I have been "Up North" you know........I may be reluctant to go North of the Thames but I have done so on occasion . Nice to see you still have proper glass milk bottles delivered. Our milkman now delivers in awful plastic things. Interestingly, I think I can see grain on those bottles.

I also find 400 film vastly more useful in the UK. In my case HP5 or TMax 400.

Well travelled then?
Yes milk in bottles but not horse delivered now, grain indeed (or aliasing from scanning, whatever) that's why I posted the shot it may be 100 but it's not grain free, I find it pleasant enough but not a must have emulsion.
I edited after you posted I think to add a lower grain 100 speed film example although the lighting is vastly different.

Svenedin · Oct 21, 2017

Chris Livsey said:
Well travelled then?

Yes I go to London as often as every 5 years even though it is nearly 20 miles away! (I do everything to avoid the place in truth).

If I want a film with a speed around 100 I tend to use FP4+. I don't think the grain is obvious and I like the way FP4 looks. This is an 8"x10" print from 35mm (Gibraltar).

Europa Point Lighthouse (8"x10" print)

Svenedin
Sep 15, 2017
4

Early evening, July. The camera batteries failed so a guesstimate of Sunny 16 using the...

Chris Livsey · Oct 21, 2017

Svenedin said:
Yes I go to London as often as every 5 years even though it is nearly 20 miles away! (I do everything to avoid the place in truth).

Same here with Manchester, just an annual pilgrimage to Real Camera http://www.realcamera.co.uk/
Usually worthwhile, handled an Ilford Witness, first and probably the last time, last year.

Svenedin · Oct 21, 2017

Now that is a camera shop! I should definitely stay away from there for the sake of my bank balance and for keeping the peace at home.

pentaxuser · Oct 21, 2017

AgX said:
Bellini products, even the firm itself, are hardly known even here at Apug.

Not that unknown. Even I have heard of Bellini's "Eight and a half"

pentaxuser

Chris Livsey · Oct 21, 2017

pentaxuser said:
Not that unknown. Even I have heard of Bellini's "Eight and a half"

pentaxuser

Venice is the best source though:
The Bellini was invented sometime between 1934 and 1948 by Giuseppe Cipriani, founder of Harry's Bar in Venice, Italy. He named the drink the Bellini because its unique pink color reminded him of the toga of a saint in a painting by 15th-centuryVenetian artist Giovanni Bellini.

Willyekerslike · Oct 21, 2017

Bellini developer can be obtained in the UK from Nik & Trick, they also have a shop on Ebay.

Regards...W

Gerald C Koch · Oct 21, 2017

Never heard of Bellini.. The one reference I have is for Hydrofen and it is made by Foma also called W 17. Times are given for Ilford but not Kentmere films. I can post the formula if anyone is interested.

foen · Oct 22, 2017

Bellini hydrophen as said mr Pompei , the owner, its like very similar to Agfa Studional because he bought some years ago the whole formulas from " Ornano Foto " and Ornano produced a clone of Studional called Ornano STD

mshchem · Oct 22, 2017

I must be a dull boy. I have used nothing but XTOL for the last 20 years. Before that HC-110, and in my youth Microdol-X. Ilford makes great film, any of the ordinary developers that Ilford (or Kodak) make will work well.

I don't scan, I print, optically, in a darkroom. When I scan anything other than Kodachrome slides with my Nikon Coolscan I am unimpressed.
Perhaps a good contact sheet is in order?
Best Mike

Rudeofus · Oct 22, 2017

Yes, Jerry, can you post the formula, so we can see what Hydrofen is similar to?

@derek andrews : If an ISO 100 emulsion looks too grainy, then most likely your scanner is the culprit. Switching developers can improve things to some extent, so can overexposure plus pulling, but neither will do miracles. Can you give us some idea which format you shoot and how far you want to enlarge the negs (either as final size or in pixels, depending on your work flow) ?

Gerald C Koch · Oct 22, 2017

Foma Hydrofen A fine grain developer

Distilled water (50°C) …………………………………………… 750 ml
Sodium sulfite (anhy) ……………………………………………… 50.0 g
Hydroquinone ……………………………………………………………………… 3.5 g
Phenidone .…………………………………………………………………………… 0.1 g
Sodium citrate ………………………………………………………………… 10.0 g
Borax ………………………………………………………………………………………… 6.0 g
Potassium bromide ………………………………………………………… 0.4 g
Distilled water to make ………………………………………… 1.0 l

Jon Buffington · Oct 22, 2017

I have shot hundreds of feet of kentmere 100 with most developed in hc110 (usually dil h) followed by id-11/d76 and rodinal. I find IMO to like d-76/id11 best, hc110 and then rodinal. Yes, there is some grain with rodinal, but it looks lovely, sharp and good tones. If you want relatively grain free negs, d76/id11 is the way to go. Example:

hc110 dil h

rodinal 1:50

darkroommike · Oct 23, 2017

Based on the instructions on the Bellini site (I don't speak Italian but I do speak tech) the developing times for this stuff are brutally short, I wouldn't think it's a fine grain developer, no times given for Kentmere, and I'd pass.

Bellini hydrophen

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