Back to Basics

ColColt · Jun 25, 2015

I've come to the decision I want to get back to developing B&W again. This time no further dark room work other than developing the negatives of which I'll scan and have prints made. I was going to order some HC-110 from B&H Photo but for whatever the reason they won't ship it? You have to pick it up so, I'll get it somewhere else. I don't think they'll ship the Rapid Fixer either.

What I can't recall about film developing is whether I used a Hypo Clearing Agent after the fixer bath. I committed all that to memory as I was doing dark room work several times a week years ago and made few notes about my method. Now, I've forgotten about how often to shake the film can or how long to fix the film. Maybe I can find some stored away notes somewhere or perhaps it's indicated on the bottle.

This will be my first developing Tri-X since around 1998!

**UPDATE**

I found the answer.

http://www.kodak.com/global/en/professional/support/techPubs/aj3/aj3.pdf

Rick A · Jun 25, 2015

B&H doesn't ship liquids that require ORMD special handling. Freestyle in Ca. will, be advised they charge a bit for it. I believe Adorama will ship too.

Hatchetman · Jun 25, 2015

B&H will ship Ilford's rapid fixer.

D-76 works for me & Tri-X

I use Hypo since Kodak told me to and I've never had a problem so I just do it. 90 seconds continuous agitation.

ColColt · Jun 25, 2015

Adorama is where I just saw all I needed...including the Hypo Clearing. I liked the tight grain structure of HC-110. D76 always looked a bit mushy to me when viewing the negative on the easel under a grain magnifier. ID-11 Plus was better I thought.

RalphLambrecht · Jun 25, 2015

this will hopefully help alittle

Xmas · Jun 25, 2015

Micro scales are cheap today

http://www.lostlabours.co.uk/photography/formulae/developers/devD76_variants.htm

ColColt · Jun 25, 2015

I remember once I substituted Kodak's indicator stop bath for Glacial Acetic Acid. I found out you do NOT want to get your nose even close to the bottle. It'll take the top of your head off...powerful stuff.

cliveh · Jun 25, 2015

ColColt said:
I've come to the decision I want to get back to developing B&W again. This time no further dark room work other than developing the negatives of which I'll scan and have prints made. I was going to order some HC-110 from B&H Photo but for whatever the reason they won't ship it? You have to pick it up so, I'll get it somewhere else. I don't think they'll ship the Rapid Fixer either.

What I can't recall about film developing is whether I used a Hypo Clearing Agent after the fixer bath. I committed all that to memory as I was doing dark room work several times a week years ago and made few notes about my method. Now, I've forgotten about how often to shake the film can or how long to fix the film. Maybe I can find some stored away notes somewhere or perhaps it's indicated on the bottle.

This will be my first developing Tri-X since around 1998!

**UPDATE**

I found the answer.

http://www.kodak.com/global/en/professional/support/techPubs/aj3/aj3.pdf

If you want to get back to basics you don't need a Hypo clearing agent. Just wash for the sufficient amount of time.

Xmas · Jun 25, 2015

Any old developer works but you need

Fresh fix
HCA

For archival stab.

People show me negatives and ask is this bromide drag
No that is exhausted fix...
Saturday fortnight last time.

gone · Jun 25, 2015

Buy from Freestyle. MUCH better service and everything else than you would get at B&H, Adorama, etc. Great prices, fast shipping. No hypo needed, and whether you need a stop bath or not is debatable. I always used one until recently, and w/ a 30 sec cold water wash the negs look exactly like they did when I used a stop bath, so I obviously don't need it. Not sure what you're shooting, but Tri-X, D76 or Rodinal, and Kodak Rapid Fixer is about as basic, and as good, as you can get.

ColColt · Jun 25, 2015

I always used a stop bath, either the Indicator Stop(the orange stuff) or the glacial acetic acid. Hypo is what I couldn't recall but probably did as it makes sense.

Not sure what you're shooting, but Tri-X, D76 or Rodinal, and Kodak Rapid Fixer is about as basic, and as good, as you can get.

I've always loved Tri-X but found Agfapan 400 and Rodinal very good as well. If memory serves me I think that's what I used to document the Mennonites in E. TN this being one of those.

Menninite Boy1 by David Fincher, on Flickr

One of the problems around here in the summer is water temperature from the tap. You won't get the recommended 68 degrees for processing film in the summer...more like 72 or greater.

Xmas · Jun 25, 2015

ColColt said:
I always used a stop bath, either the Indicator Stop(the orange stuff) or the glacial acetic acid. Hypo is what I couldn't recall but probably did as it makes sense.

I've always loved Tri-X but found Agfapan 400 and Rodinal very good as well. If memory serves me I think that's what I used to document the Mennonites in E. TN this being one of those.

Menninite Boy1 by David Fincher, on Flickr

One of the problems around here in the summer is water temperature from the tap. You won't get the recommended 68 degrees for processing film in the summer...more like 72 or greater.

Ilford provide a chart at bottom of this page
http://www.ilfordphoto.com/applications/page.asp?n=87
Fog level is not really higher at 72

ColColt · Jun 25, 2015

I could keep the developer, stop bath and fixer at the proper temperature but when it came time to wash from the tap, that's a different story. I'd keep tabs on the water temperature I used to mix the developer and others but had little control over the wash.

I seemed to have read as long as you keep all chemistry within 3 degrees of each other you should be fine. I don't think B&W is that critical...Cibachrome was a different story.

John Bragg · Jun 25, 2015

ColColt said:
I could keep the developer, stop bath and fixer at the proper temperature but when it came time to wash from the tap, that's a different story. I'd keep tabs on the water temperature I used to mix the developer and others but had little control over the wash.

I seemed to have read as long as you keep all chemistry within 3 degrees of each other you should be fine. I don't think B&W is that critical...Cibachrome was a different story.

Temperature control is easy when washing if you use the Ilford method. Fill tank with water and invert 5 times and empty. Fill again with water and invert 10 times and empty. Fill again and invert 20 times and empty. That is it ! Sounds crazy but I can confirm that it works and many others here will tell you the same. Saves water and washes efficiently with minimum effort and water can be tempered and poured in from a jug. Just remember, this only works with non hardening fixer (which is most these days).

ColColt · Jun 25, 2015

Of course you have to store those containers somewhere where it's 68 degrees in order for that to work and I know of no where here in the house it's that cool. The garage attached to the house is 78 degrees when it's 90 outside.

I've never used a non hardening fixer for film, always Kodak's two part fix with hardener.

Sirius Glass · Jun 25, 2015

I process black & white film two ways:
1) For all film sizes: Develop with replenished XTOL [for finer grain, increased sharpness and great tonality], Kodak Stop Bath with indicator, and hypo. Hypo Clearing Agent would reduce the amount of water needed for washing, but when I develop in the Jobo processor it only takes eight 500ml of water rinsed of 30 seconds each.
2) For larger than 35mm film, I use Rolo Pyro as a two bath developer1 [with Solution A reused for staining], water for stop bath, and TF4 or TF5 for fixing and eight 500ml of water for rinsing. Again in the Jobo processor.

1Solution A for about seven minutes, empty tank, Solution B for about five minutes [it stops when the absorbed Solution A is used up], empty tank, reuse Solution A for staining for one minute, ... Stop bath with indicator is acidic and will not stop the reaction so water is used instead.

37th Exposure · Jun 25, 2015

ColColt said:
I've never used a non hardening fixer for film, always Kodak's two part fix with hardener.

Then you will definitely need Hypo Clearing Agent from Kodak or another manufacturer. Wash times would be at least half an hour with a hardening fix and no Hypo Clear. Just follow the directions on the package as they vary from brand to brand. B&H will ship Kodak's Kodafix. Similar to Kodak's Rapid Fix except in a single bottle and a bit longer fixing time for most films.

MattKing · Jun 25, 2015

Pedantry warning ....

Please don't use the term "hypo" when you mean "hypo clearing agent".

By itself, "hypo" is an out of date term for fixer, so a reference to "hypo" means to me a reference to fixer.

"HCA" or "wash aid" are excellent alternatives that do not confuse.

Pedantry completed ....

I use stop bath and HCA for film.

While the stop bath can be replaced with a good, extensive, tempered water rinse, I like the results from stop bath, which is very cheap. If I am developing a very few rolls, I use the stop bath at a greater dilution.

With respect to HCA, it does aid in washing and it does save water. I consider the so called Ilford wash method to be a potential source of problems, as I don't believe it includes much room for error.

This thread has lots of useful information about film washing: (there was a url link here which no longer exists)

Sirius Glass · Jun 26, 2015

I still use the term hypo for fixer. Hypo because nothing was broken.

I have no tolerance for calling Hypo Clearing Agent hypo. Hypo Clearing Agent is not hypo! And I use Hypo Clearing Agent for paper to save water.

Stop bath is cheap and I learned early on that water alone in some location can cause problems the would not occur if stop bath had been used.

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