B&W Slides

BMbikerider · Oct 23, 2012

I have seen reference to this before but cannot find a thread that connects, so if you have given the information before, I'm sorry to ask it again.

I want to start processing B&W film to make transparencies, so which film would you use to give the clearest tint free base? Are there any commercial kits available that I can buy (in UK) to get me started?

Thanks in anticipation.

AgX · Oct 23, 2012

Just recently a film on clear, colourless base, which in addition can provide a high density-range as slide-film has been released as type 135: Adox Silvermax. As far as I know no data has been released yet.

There is a reversal kit from Foma available.

Peltigera · Oct 23, 2012

Look here for Foma reversal B&W film. http://www.ag-photographic.co.uk/foma-film-12-c.asp

Ag Photographic also sell Rollei film which is made on a clear (non-acetate) base.

coigach · Oct 23, 2012

Do a search to see previous APUG threads on reverse processing, lots of useful info.

Also, if you fancy lab processed rather than home processed, I'd recommend dr5 in the US, I've been using them for years and am very happy with quality + service - I send them over in bulk batches several times a year from UK to help with postage costs. Have a look in my APUG gallery for some samples.

Hope this helps.

Edit: just noticed you are not a subscriber so cannot view gallery. Here's an attachment of a dr5 reverse processed Ilford Delta 100 transparency for reference.

wy2l · Oct 23, 2012

The www.dr5.com web site has information (DMAX) about various films, even if you process at home.

nexus757 · Oct 23, 2012

Ilford FP4 is a good choice. Processing details here: http://www.ilfordphoto.com/Webfiles/20114271220441194.pdf

BMbikerider · Oct 23, 2012

I have just found a PDF file from Ilford giving development times and chemicals needed for processing B&W slides. They suggest Pan F and this is what they base their times on. However the chemicals needed for the bleaching stage requires Sulphuric Acid. Now that is pretty savage stuff and I am not sure I would be happy using it.

There is a proprietary kit made by FOMA and is 'occasionally' available in the UK but it is very expensive (The words of a supplier) They are not the best company to deal with when fulfilling orders so he told me. I will give this a bit of thought. It is the acid that puts me off.

I have some which I did myself perhaps 35-40 years ago then sepia toned them. They are mounted in glass and are as good as the day they were made. I just wanted to reproduce modern subjects the same way.

richyd · Oct 23, 2012

I researched developing B&W slides earlier this year and experimented finding a formula and chemicals I could get hold of but don't have facilities at the moment. Some of the chemicals I had to get fron eBay suppliers. There are a ton of threads on this site and others that give a lot of practical information and experience on the process, just use the search facility.

The Foma kit is available here but is produced for the Foma R100 film and you would have to do trials if you wanted to use other films. I noticed recently that AG Photographic appear to have priced the Foma kit at nearly double its usual price but Silverprint had it listed at around £30 something the last time I looked. I am guessing AGs pricing is a mistake. Either way it works out quite expensive.

Others here have mentioned dr5 but I could recommend Photostudio13 in Germany who process a number of mainly Rollei marketed films. They are cheaper, the service and quality is very good and more convenient for UK based users.

nexus757 · Oct 23, 2012

Any B/W bleach requires acid of some sort, AFAIK. If you can't get concentrated sulphuric acid just use regular battery acid from an auto supply store. About 220ml or 7.5 U.S. ounces per gallon is sufficient to make the Ilford Part B bleach.
Also, cut the permaganate in half in Part A if you are trying to reverse an old school emulsion like Efke or Adox. Full strength will literally turn the emulsion into jelly.

kevs · Oct 24, 2012

Ilford XP2 Super can be processed in E-6 chemicals to give a dye-image black and white tranny; IIRC you need to expose it at 50 ASA. I don't know how dense the base tint is; I did this with XP1 back in the day, and obtained reasonable results. YMMV.

Cheers,
kevs

BMbikerider · Oct 24, 2012

The Supplier I mentioned who said the FOMA kit was expensive was AG which you refer to. If they say it is expensive I don't think it was a mistake. I never thought about Silverprint, and as I am going to London next month I will call in and see what they have on offer.

AgX · Oct 24, 2012

A german mail-order dealer asks about 28€ for it.

Henning Serger · Nov 4, 2012

BMbikerider said:
I have seen reference to this before but cannot find a thread that connects, so if you have given the information before, I'm sorry to ask it again.

I want to start processing B&W film to make transparencies, so which film would you use to give the clearest tint free base? Are there any commercial kits available that I can buy (in UK) to get me started?

Thanks in anticipation.

Hello,

BW transparencies in general look best if your film has (after the reversal development) a very low Dmin value, and a very high Dmax value.
In most cases you get this using films with a clear base. The following films all have a clear base and deliver very good to excellent results reversal processed (in alphabetical order):

Adox Silvermax
Adox CMS 20 II
Agfa Scala 200X
Agfa Copex Rapid
Fomapan R
Ilford Delta 100 (120)
Rollei Retro 80S
Rollei Superpan 200
Rollei Retro 400S
Rollei IR

As you are living in the UK, the most convenient option for you is probably sending your films to one of the 5 BW reversal labs in Germany (Germany is the "paradise for slide film shooters", in no other market reversal film is so popular).
I can recommend Photostudio 13 www.photostudio13.de (they are developing all the above mentioned films in the [modified] Scala reversal process) and
Klaus Wehner www.schwarz-weiss-dia.de (he has designed his own high-end 20-step reversal process).
Both labs do international business / shipping.

Best regards,
Henning

coigach · Nov 6, 2012

Here's a recipe for TMAX:
http://believeinfilm.com/stuff/kevins-bw-reversal-film-process

dr5chrome · Nov 15, 2012

Holy-Cow.... 'the bleach recipe' ... :w00t:
..hold on to your seats....

coigach said:
Here's a recipe for TMAX:
http://believeinfilm.com/stuff/kevins-bw-reversal-film-process

Raghu Kuvempunagar · Jan 24, 2020

Henning Serger said:
BW transparencies in general look best if your film has (after the reversal development) a very low Dmin value, and a very high Dmax value.

@Henning Serger: what is the DMax of Adox CMS 20 ii after reversal processing?

Louis Nargi · Jan 24, 2020

I'v never tried it but I heard that Try-x can be developed as a slide film.

Bill Burk · Jan 24, 2020

BMbikerider said:
which film would you use to give the clearest tint free base?

Keep asking this question.

Much 35mm film has a "neutral gray base tint" for anti-halation - because they assume you are planning to print. Gray base has no impact on printing.

But it has an impact on direct projection. You'll lose a stop of light at the projection screen if you pick the wrong film.

FP4 has a gray tint.

Henning Serger · Jan 25, 2020

Raghu Kuvempunagar said:
@Henning Serger: what is the DMax of Adox CMS 20 ii after reversal processing?

It depends on the process you use. I am using it so far in the Scala reversal process of professional lab Photo Studio 13 in Germany. Dmax has been around 3.3.
Generally their Scala process delivers not the highest Dmax technically possible, but a very nice tonality and gradation whith most reversal-capable BW films. And Dmax is high enough to get real deep blacks in projection with high-power projectors. That is important for me.
I plan to test the film in the coming ADOX Scala reversal process, too. I am currently testing the kit for a test report in the PhotoKlassik film photography print magazine.

Best regards,
Henning

Raghu Kuvempunagar · Jan 25, 2020

Henning Serger said:
Dmax has been around 3.3.

That's quite impressive!! Will be fantastic if Adox reversal process gives even better DMax. What is the maximum achievable density on Adox CMS 20 ii? Is there a datasheet?

Europan · Jan 26, 2020

The negative-positive route is open. Shoot on any film stock you like, make contacts on cheap simple print film such as ORWO PF 2 or Kodak X302 or on one of the stocks listed above by Henning Serger. Advantages are that you can manipulate density and contrast, replace a positive, burn in text or something else, combine-print (split screen), dye a positive, whatnot.

B&W Slides

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