Attn. all film manufacturers

Curt · Jun 17, 2006

Anything new in three by two? (2 1/4 x 3 1/4) sheet film

JandC
Fuji
Kodak
Ilford
Adox
Efke
Rollei
Orwo
Exapto
Dolochem
Aldophlo
Bergger
Arista
Homemade

Not roll, but roll is needed in ISO/ASA 25

If not, why not

Is the shift away from smaller formats toward larger formats?

The availability is dwindling and the available is due in soon. Meaning that the manufacturers are not producing or they are not being given orders to fill or they ending small format interest for the more lucrative large format sheet film lines.

Petzi · Jun 17, 2006

Couldn't you just use 6.5 x 9 cm sheet film, which is available?

aoresteen · Jun 17, 2006

6.5 x 9 cm is NOT the same size as 2 1/4 x 3 1/4. It is bigger.

JandC and Ilford make 2 1/4 x 3 1/4 sheet film. I have a bunch in my freezer.

There is a simple reason why there isn't a lot of 2 1/4 x 3 1/4 film. It's called roll film backs.

My Cambo SF69 6x9 view handles roll film backs easily. But not sheet film. I had to have SK Grimes make me a back just to use 2 1/4 x 3 1/4 sheet film. They grafted a Speed Graphic back to a Cambo 6x9 back frame.

Roger Hicks · Jun 17, 2006

6.5 x 9cm and 2-1/4 x 3-1/4 film are different sizes but the holders are the same size and can be used in the same camera. Why you'd want tiny cut film instead of rollfilm is, as Tony points out, another matter.

The other 'families' with the same external holder dimensions and different internal dimensions are:

4x5 inch & 9x12cm

5x7 inch, 13x18cm and half plate

8x10 inch and 18x24cm.

Cheers,

Roger

Curt · Jun 17, 2006

Roger I converted the back on my Busch C to a Graphic back to accept roll and Grafmatic holders. So I can use sheet, roll and sheets in sleeves. I like roll film, I have two "23's" and a "22" roll film holder. some times I just want to shoot a few frames or do the Zone System.

Sheet film doesn't start at 4x5 inch size. In 2x3 it's smaller, cheaper, lighter, and individually flexible. Then there is the issue of the Ground Glass. With roll I would have to take the GG off put on the roll holder shoot and repeat. I know I can use the range finder etc. With sheet it's a view camera. Focus, put in a holder and shoot. I have both setups and each has it's own fine points. I might want to shoot a scene and develop the negative in two different developers or different dilutions. And what about the people who only have the camera with sheet film holders? They would like a selection in todays emulsions for 2x3.

Best Regards,
Curt

Petzi · Jun 17, 2006

I don't question that the small sheet film makes sense in some cases. There are a number of nice Linhof Technika's for that format, for instance.

Roger Hicks · Jun 17, 2006

Dear Curt,

To each his own. I hardly ever use 4x5 any more because I regard it merely as slightly superior rollfilm (I exaggerate, but not very much), and with the 'baby' Linhof I find it quicker to pop off the GG and pop on the RF holder than to load the cut-film holders and slip 'em under. And my feeling is that if a shot is worth individual development, it's worth a bigger format too.

I can use 6x9 cut film on the Linhof and the Graflex XL, or even the 4x5 Technikardan with the reducing back. I just haven't, for years. Sure, I take your point, but I fear it's a tiny market, a sub-niche of a niche.

None of this means that you are wrong or that I am right, of course.

Cheers,

Roger

David A. Goldfarb · Jun 17, 2006

I've been using Efke 100 and J&C Classic 200 and 400 (which hasn't been around lately). I'd be happy with Efke 100 and Classic 400 in that format for my Tech V 23. J&C also has had HP5+ lately.

Curt · Jun 17, 2006

Of course three cuts of a 5X7 sheet yields four 2 1/4 X 3 1/4 sheets of the emulsion of availability in 5X7.

Curt

David A. Goldfarb · Jun 17, 2006

Always glad to have another reason to justify what I spent on that Rotatrim.

Petzi · Jun 17, 2006

I think I know a place that has lots of APX 100 in 6.5 x 9 cm, so if anyone wants that, drop me a pm, and I'll call them.

Ilford Photo list FP4+ as available in 6.5 x 9 cm and 2.5 x 3.5 in, but the latter only "while stock lasts".

aoresteen · Jun 17, 2006

I use sheet film when I have my rollbacks loaded with colour and I want a shot in B&W.

Most of the time I have a roll back loaded with Verichrome Pan 120 so I don't need the sheet film unless I need a bit more speed and then I pop in a sheet of HP-5.

I just like the flexibility and not having to carry 4 or 5 roll backs (well I have only two but you get the point).

Curt · Jun 18, 2006

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I use sheet film when I have my rollbacks loaded with colour and I want a shot in B&W.

Most of the time I have a roll back loaded with Verichrome Pan 120 so I don't need the sheet film unless I need a bit more speed and then I pop in a sheet of HP-5.

I just like the flexibility and not having to carry 4 or 5 roll backs (well I have only two but you get the point).
__________________

Those are excellent points Tony. Color roll film and B&W sheet film for some of my trips and outings would be very helpful. I have three rollbacks and a half dozen Grafmatics and over a dozen new film holders for my Busch C 2x3 which I have the Graflok back on. I don't shoot in color but I will have to think about it again. What's available in 120 I'm out of date? And which lab to use?

Best Regards,

Curt

John had some Efke 25 cut and packaged for me and I have 15 25 sheet "tropical" packages of it on hand now. I tried to order more but the out of quantity popup said no. John made an extra effort to get the 2 1/4 3 1/4 film for me and I am very appreciative for that effort. I hope he will have some more in stock before I run out.

also:
I have had some problems getting Efke 23 in 120 rolls so I have switched to Rollei, I wish they had it in small sheets because it is the cats meow for fine grain film. It's expensive but worth every cent. I do like Ilford 50 that I rate at 40 with Rodinal 1:50 but I fear that they will discontinue it in favor of ULF and they don't/won't make it in sheet. Too bad, at one time Panatomic-X was available in sheet. It's not impossible to do. Imagine if... Ilford put out Ilford Pan F in any sheet size? It would fly out the door in sales.

Harrigan · Jun 18, 2006

I also think your small sheet film is indeed a niche in a niche market. The thing about smaller formats is you can always cut down larger film, although its a pain its not that hard. Anyway Curt you have 375 sheets which seem like a good stash to me, no? You are lucky JC had some cut for you they wont even return my emails, ever. I've given up on them and moved on to other vendors.

I don't know if pan-f sheet would fly off the shelves but I would certainly buy it in 8x10 if the price was inline with current offerings.

aoresteen · Jun 18, 2006

Harrigan wrote:

"You are lucky JC had some cut for you they wont even return my emails, ever. I've given up on them and moved on to other vendors."

Humm. John has always replied to my emails within a day or two. Someting is wrong here. Are you sure you have the correct email address?

Curt,

I use Portra 160NC and Portra 800. ALso Ultra 100 & 400. The local camera shop still does 120 so I let them process it. Fuji & others make a ton of colour films in 120. Check out B&H's web site for info.

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=NavBar&A=search&Q=&ci=331

DBP · Jun 18, 2006

aoresteen said:
Most of the time I have a roll back loaded with Verichrome Pan 120 so I don't need the sheet film unless I need a bit more speed and then I pop in a sheet of HP-5.

Where did you get Verichrome Pan?

Curt · Jun 18, 2006

It does seem strange, John replies to my emails, he may not have what I need but they do get back to me. At this time in history I think all of film photography is a Niche market. The universality is over and each emulsion and size is a on thin ice. Any day the manufacturers could stop production of a paper, chemical or film. With drawing or painting it's not so. Photography is one of the unique Arts that is completely technical product driven. Take away part of the equation and there is no Art. Take away a particular film or paper or chemical and the Art for changes for that individual who expresses his/her self in their presentation. Supplies are like liberty, if you don't continue to demand them they will soon disappear. Sure I could cut down film from a larger size but what if someone read the thread and said "I can start a film cutting service". Or a manufacturer might rethink their strategy.

Curt

nworth · Jun 19, 2006

Not all 2-1/4X3-1/4 sheet film cameras can take a roll film adapter. I have one that only accepts sheet film holders. Another issue is that some of us like the option of using Zone System development with sheets. I will probably not suffer great damage if 2-/14X3-1/4 sheet film dies, but I will lose what I consider to be a valuable tool.

derevaun · Jun 19, 2006

What a scary thread! I've got to get working on that 127 rollfilm back before it's too late.

Attn. all film manufacturers

Curt

Petzi

aoresteen

Roger Hicks

Curt

Petzi

Roger Hicks

David A. Goldfarb

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Curt

David A. Goldfarb

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Petzi

aoresteen

Curt

Harrigan

aoresteen

DBP

Curt

nworth

derevaun

Attn. all film manufacturers

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