Aristo - new info

Ken Nadvornick · Sep 7, 2010

Barry S said:
Can anyone confirm if the D2-HI lamp is a direct replacement for the lamp in the Zone VI 4x5 cold light head? It looks like the same lamp, but I'd like to confirm it. Thanks.

The regular lamp is listed at 70-watts, while the HI lamp is listed at 110-watts. Probably best to check with Louise regarding compatibility. Perhaps there might already be a history of successful upgrades?

Ken

Reinhold · Sep 7, 2010

I replaced the original Zone VI lamp with the D2 V54 Hi Output lamp several years ago. It fits just fine, but Louise cautions that the holes in the reflector plate ...may... need a bit of elongation. In my case everything fit fine.

That Hi Output lamp puts out a lotta light !!!

If you're printing 16x20's and larger, you'll be glad you have it. 20 second exposures with normal 6x6 and 6x7 negatives at f8+ are typical.

Buuuut... for printing 5x7's & even 8x10's, I slip a Kokin #123 neutral density filter into the little red filter drawer on my Beseler. Knocks 2 stops off of the light.

Reinhold

www.classicBWphoto.com

Barry S · Sep 7, 2010

Thank you Ken and Reinhold! It sounds like the lamp is compatible. I bought a Zone VI head this year, but unfortunately the lamp was broken.

jp80874 · Sep 7, 2010

Thanks for making the effort guys. I put in a request today for a replacement spare for my model 1212, 110 volt, 60hz, 240 watt that is in a custom conversion of the Durst 138S to allow 8x10 negative. I hope they know what bulb/tube that is. I said if that wasn't enough information, please ask what you need to know.

John Powers

Ken Nadvornick · Sep 7, 2010

jp80874 said:
Thanks for making the effort guys. I put in a request today for a replacement spare for my model 1212, 110 volt, 60hz, 240 watt that is in a custom conversion of the Durst 138S to allow 8x10 negative.

Thanks, John. The greater the number of Aristo users contacting them right now, the better our chances of convincing them to continue the supply of replacement lamp grids for all of our models.

Is that the converted enlarger in the first two of your images? It looks like the Aristo 1212 unit on top. Pretty impressive. And quite the shoehorned fit!

Ken

jp80874 · Sep 7, 2010

Ken Nadvornick said:
Thanks, John. The greater the number of Aristo users contacting them right now, the better our chances of convincing them to continue the supply of replacement lamp grids for all of our models.

Is that the converted enlarger in the first two of your images? It looks like the Aristo 1212 unit on top. Pretty impressive. And quite the shoehorned fit!

Ken

That is the beast. Michael Mutmansky designed & built it using it for a while. He moved on to other things and I bought it. It remains one inch from the ceiling. There is fine focus on the bellows. For gross focus I move the table up and down. With the 300mm lens I can make a full negative print 20"x24" with a lot of table movement left. I also have a 240mm lens should I ever want to crop or go larger full frame.

Thanks again for getting the ball moving.

John

jp80874 · Sep 9, 2010

Just so we are all on the same page, following is my post re: the Aristo light and Louise's response. I thanked her for keeping me informed.

John Powers

"Dear John,

Thank you for your note below.
I've taken some time in responding to you for a number of reasons.
I believe from what you described the lamp is the 1212 series lamp.
These lamps are unavailable at this time.

I am working on the replacement tube issue for the top 20 most requested
Aristo lamps, but it's not a simple task for a few reasons.

Aristo left very little documentation on their items. The production
templates for the lamps were only found this past March. At least this
gives the basic configuration of the lamp and other key information, but
there is still a lot more engineering work to do. With the load they
are working on now I don't see them getting to this lamp until next
year.

I'll keep your note and notify you as I get closer to production on that
lamp style.

Best Regards,
Louise M. Kessler
LCD Lighting, Inc.
Voltarc
37 Robinson Blvd.
Orange, CT 06477
Tel 1-203-799-7877 ext 3163
Fax 1-203-795-5267
email: louise.kessler@voltarc.com
email: lkessler@LCDL.com

From: info@light-sources.com [mailto:info@light-sources.com]
Sent: Tuesday, September 07, 2010 4:29 PM
To: ANDROS, JOHN
Subject: replacement bulbs/tubes for Aristo cold lights | Message from
www.light-sources.com

Division: Corporate Name: John Powers
Company: individual
Country: United States
State/Province: Ohio
City: Bath
ZIP: 44210
How did he/she hear about us: friend

I have been following the APUG thread about your company possibly
making replacement bulbs/tubes for Aristo cold light heads. My unit is
functioning, but a spare at a price I can afford makes sense. The plate
on the head reads model 1212, 110 volts, 60 hz, 240 watts. This is a
custom conversion of a Durst model 138S expanding its use from 5"x7"
format to 8"x10" negatives. If you need more information please ask
and tell me where to find the answers on the unit.

Thank you,

John Powers"

Ken Nadvornick · Sep 9, 2010

jp80874 said:
Just so we are all on the same page, following is my post re: the Aristo light and Louise's response. I thanked her for keeping me informed.

Thanks for this, John. I am in the same boat priority-wise as you. Due to the high cost of the original VCL4500 units, the dual-tube series of lamps that they require is likely going to be nowhere near the top of her list. Prioritizing production only makes sense.

But I do believe that if those of us who need these lamps can periodically remind Light Sources of those needs, the ball will indeed keep rolling. I'm assuming that Louise can only move forward to the extent that her management allows her to move. And they will only allow movement if they perceive sufficient demand.

Just last evening I wrote to congratulate her on her success in getting the D2-HI lamps back to a production run. I felt it appropriate to do so given how hard she has worked on this for all of us. I sense it would have been very easy for her to simply walk away from the Aristo line. But she chose not to.

Here is a portion of that exchange:

Ken: "Congratulations on getting a production run of the D2-HI replacement lamps started. Nice job! I know a number of the posters on APUG are very happy right now. And it makes Light Sources look very good. Way to go."

Louise: "Thank you… It may seem like it’s JUST happened, but I’ve been working with engineering since January to get the D2-HI to a stage where I can actually give a lead time for production. Every lamp takes 5-6 months of work to activate it… I’ll keep pushing."

Ken

Jeff Bannow · Sep 10, 2010

Reinhold said:
I just got the same response from Louise.

Now all those 4x5 Omega's and Beselers with those old Aristo single-grade lamps can be retrofitted with V54 lamps. Good news indeed.

Six months from now, how would someone find this information if they just blew a tube and didn't know where to look? APUG still doesn't have a user friendly "Resources" section (not a chatterbox forum, but a bona-fide list of contacts for the stuff we all need to keep our art alive).

Reinhold

www.classicBWphoto.com

Are we positive that this bulb can go into a Aristo D2 head? This would turn it into a D2 high, compatible with VC papers?

Ken Nadvornick · Sep 10, 2010

Jeff Bannow said:
Are we positive that this bulb can go into a Aristo D2 head? This would turn it into a D2 high, compatible with VC papers?

My understanding is that the new production run of D2-HI lamp grids are only going to be the V-54 variable contrast compatible tube type. So yes, the upgraded head would become a (very bright) VC-compatible light source.

As far as compatibility with the D2 head, the original Aristo website shows both the standard and HI versions of the lamp as options for the now discontinued D2 head. In fact, clicking on the 'D2' or 'D2-HI' links takes you to the exact same page.

However, checking for compatibility with Louise is always the best (and easiest) option.

Ken

Jeff Bannow · Sep 10, 2010

Ken Nadvornick said:
However, checking for compatibility with Louise is always the best (and easiest) option.

Ken

I'll email her. Thanks!

Besk · Sep 10, 2010

The future availability of the replacement light for the D2 is great news. I can imgine that heads for the D2 were the largest sellers for Aristo.

I have just e-mailed Ms. Kessler to order one when they will be available.

George Collier · Sep 11, 2010

I have the CL45, which is a single bulb and has the filter drawer for 6" filters. I also have a very old version, probably the D2, which housed just the lamp and diffusion plexi underneath, and originally came with the HI (Hi Intensity) lamp, quite blue and unsuitable for VC papers. I used it with Seagull for many years.
When the bulb failed, I bought the new head after speaking with Rich Metah, the chief engineer at the time, and of the Metah family which I guess sold out to the current owners. The new one came with the V54 lamp, which works well with filters, although contrast grades are not linear, but the range is very good.
One thing - the folks at Aristo at the time I bought this head (could have been Louise, don't know) told me that the dual bulb version was not as bright as the single V54 bulb at any contrast setting, in addition to being a much more expensive head.

Did someone in the thread say that the V54 lamp will fit the original old D2 head? It won't have the filter drawer, but at least it can be used with the lamp.

BTW, I have also used the V54 with graded and it works fine, although I can't begin to get the quality from the graded papers I have tried that I can with Ilford MG IV (or the old Forte V). The separation in the low values just isn't there.

Ken Nadvornick · Sep 12, 2010

George Collier said:
The new one came with the V54 lamp, which works well with filters, although contrast grades are not linear, but the range is very good.

This was exactly my experience as well. Here are my numbers for Ilford MGIV RC when contact printed using the (under the lens) Ilford discreet filter set, a V54 lamp, a 31-step Stouffer wedge, and after safelight fog testing was completed. Steps were judged visually under a standardized white viewing light without the aid of a reflection densitometer. Note the non-linear contrast grade progression in the right column:

Here's a similar table for the same paper, but now using my VCL4500. The available dial-in range on the controller is from '0.0' to '5.0'. By design, the contrast grades now progress linearly because the filtration can be infinitely varied:

* This '0.0' setting was used together with the green-only lamp switch. Testing later with the blue-only lamp switch I was not able to reach any further than an ISO grade '5' contrast.

I have a similar set of VCL filtrations for Ilford MGIV FB as well. They are not an exact match, but they are very, very close. This means I can proof on RC for speed, cost, and convenience, knowing that the negative contrasts I see in those proofs will translate very closely to the FB paper.

George Collier said:
One thing - the folks at Aristo at the time I bought this head (could have been Louise, don't know) told me that the dual bulb version was not as bright as the single V54 bulb at any contrast setting, in addition to being a much more expensive head.

This is also my understand from her. Although in my current situation I couldn't say just how much. My VCL4500 tubes are tired and need replacement. Tired means very long exposures because they have dimmed with age. But I normally do not make huge enlargements anyway, so I suspect that a new replacement set would work just fine for me. For my needs, trading off printing speed for simple, dial-in linear contrast grade progression is worth it.

My standard V54 tube (non-HI) that replaced the original tube in my Zone VI head is very bright. So much so that I installed a DIY custom cut Roscoe ND filter into the head to cut back 2 stops of output.

These new D2-HI replacement tubes must be like artificial suns...

:eek:

Ken

[Edit: Changes to the VCL4500 table. Realized I was incorrectly showing preliminary, not final, values.]

MattKing · Sep 12, 2010

Ken:

How did you include such great tables into your APUG post? Are they inserted images, and if so, what type?

Ken Nadvornick · Sep 12, 2010

MattKing said:
Ken:

How did you include such great tables into your APUG post? Are they inserted images, and if so, what type?

Yep, inserted images. They are [were originally, see edits below] 1-bit monochrome BMPs created with Windows Paint. I just made sure to select a matching font/size (Verdana/10pt). I then outlined them 1-pixel wide in black. They are only about 12 KB apiece.

However, it seems I misjudged the background color ever so slightly. Thought it was white, not very light gray. Since they're separately saved on my webspace server, I might try some color picking to match and redo them - just to be anal so my friends will be convinced they've been right all along...

Ken

[Edit: Yes, I do realize they cannot be 1-bit if I want to match shades of gray...]

[Edit: Now they appear to match, but have morphed into 24-bit 260 KB each, and the background RGB triplet is 'FAFAFA'...]

jgjbowen · Sep 13, 2010

Great News. Thanks to all for the hard work. I'll need to order extra bulbs for all my lamps.

Ken Nadvornick · Sep 13, 2010

jgjbowen said:
Great News. Thanks to all for the hard work. I'll need to order extra bulbs for all my lamps.

That's just excellent. And it's really Louise who has been running with the ball on this. Often without a great deal of support. She continues working to keep the lamp portion of the Aristo product line alive. Every lamp order, or expression of interest in the continuation of lamp production, helps the situation. Especially - for the sake of visibility - if made through the Light Sources corporate contact web page here.

As pointed out by John Powers in a previous post ((there was a url link here which no longer exists)), Louise is concentrating her efforts on a list of the top 20 best-selling lamps. The D2-HI lamp was first in line. Depending on the lamp models you may need to order and their position on the list, patience may be required.

As I've stated many times, I'm in that same patience boat as well.

I think it's interesting to note that in the arena of analog photography only a very few products have been discontinued or dropped, only to be later resurrected by popular demand. I can think of Velvia 50 transparency film, the Agfa/ADOX papers and film, silver chloride contact paper (Lodima), Polaroid format integral film (Impossible Project), and perhaps Rodinal? Although I don't know if that ever completely ended in the first place. There are probably a few others.

The common factor in all of the above are that they were/are photographic end user supplies. Louise is trying to resurrect parts for high end pieces of photographic hardware. And not for large demand camera hardware, either. Darkroom hardware. A tiny nested product niche contained within several other tiny niches.

And apparently due to the confused state of Aristo at its demise, she is being forced to champion the re-engineering of those hardware products, since key original information regarding their manufacture is missing. This is a hugely daunting task that she has undertaken. Especially so in the current economic climate.

So far she has been able get at least one lamp grid to the restart of production stage. If we express enough interest, there may also be others down the line.

Ken

Jeff Bannow · Sep 13, 2010

So, how many bulbs would be considered a lifetime supply?

jp80874 · Sep 13, 2010

Jeff Bannow said:
So, how many bulbs would be considered a lifetime supply?

If Eva finds out what you have been up to, NONE!

John

Jeff Bannow · Sep 13, 2010

jp80874 said:
If Eva finds out what you have been up to, NONE!

John

Nah, I have the best wife in the world. While printing recently, she looked at me and commented that "our darkroom is too small. We should at least double it." This is in a darkroom that's already 15'x15' or so.

Ken Nadvornick · Sep 13, 2010

Jeff Bannow said:
So, how many bulbs would be considered a lifetime supply?

Aristo claimed that lamp grids would need replacement every 5 or so years in a commercial production environment. So it depends on your age, usage patterns, the state of your existing lamp, and - of course - your wallet.

In my own case, I'm thinking two new lamps should do it for me. Since my current twin-tube set is in need of immediate replacement, that means one replacement to install right away, and one in reserve to cover premature failure, breakage, defects, etc.

I might also think that resale value on the entire head assembly would be enhanced if a brand new unused backup lamp were able to be offered in the package.

Now I'm 56 years old. Were I 36 my needs might be different. And the replacement lamp set I require was originally priced at $475 each, as I recall. So the price of a newly re-engineered version could be an issue. I'll just have to wait and see.

I also still have my Zone VI single tube head with an upgraded standard brightness V54 Aristo lamp. I'm thinking about purchasing one of the new D2-HI lamps as a backup for that in the event that Louise never makes it far enough down the list to my first choice.

Ken

George Collier · Sep 14, 2010

Well, I just found out that the bulb they are going to make - the D2-HI-LO-V54 replacement lamp, will not fit my CL45 head. She said she will keep me on the list for mine.
Just a cautionary note - be sure you have the right head - this fits the old D2 workhorse head from the 70s and since, no filter drawer.

ic-racer · Sep 14, 2010

"Top twenty"

From the brochure I have, twenty seems like just about every enlarging lamp they made. So, perhaps the 1414 might be a possibility. I don't use the head anymore, but its resale value will be much better with a new V54 tube.

Steve Goldstein · Sep 23, 2010

I just received an email from Louise. The dock date for the D2-HI-LO-V54 lamps is 18 October 2010.

Aristo - new info

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