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Arista B&W Wetting Agent has gone south..

peter k.

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Son of a gun, my Arista B&W Wetting Agent has gone south.. picked it up this morning and there is a sediment of a brown something in the bottom, not going to use it, but has anyone else have had this happen?
Age perhaps.. always tightly capped, about a 10th used, as you only need a drop or two.
Just curious, any ideas of why?
 

Sirius Glass

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Shake it up and then run it through a paper filter and get the sediment out.
 

Sirius Glass

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If I reuse diluted surfactant it will build up sediments over time. I either filter it or dump it.
 
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peter k.

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This bottle is the original that we are referring to, not yet diluted.
From this bottle we dilute it, the number of drops depending on how much quantity were making, that is going into distilled water.
So why would there be a sediment. Just can't understand it going south, except maybe for age.
 

jim appleyard

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Give Freestyle a call, something may be wrong. I've never had that happen, but I've only used Kodak or Ilford WA, although Arista products are good, too.
 

guangong

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Why would anybody reuse a wetting agent. I just throw a capful of FotoFlo into water and dump when processing session finished. FotoFlo also seems to keep the sink drains clean. A bottle of FotoFlo lasts a very long time.
 

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peter k. said:
Sediment???
So this is normal?
Click to expand...

hi peter k
sometimes chemicals get old, or they go through heat/cold changes and
sometimes stuff like you have going on happens.

to be honest, i've never used anything but photoflo
and i used-up a bottle a couple of years ago purchased in something like 1982.
it never had sediment went through like 4 or 5 different moves fluxuating temperatures
( one place i had my darkroom was like 100+ºF in the summer and in the wintertime /60-something ) ...
the amber bottle i am working off of now is older than the plastic one
absolutely no clue where it is from, it's about 4"high and smells like flowers. .. still, no sediment.
i've never re-used it, it takes a couple of drops in a tank or try and that small bottle ( 4" high )
is like a lifetime supply for someone over 30 ...
 

Sirius Glass

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guangong said:
Why would anybody reuse a wetting agent. I just throw a capful of FotoFlo into water and dump when processing session finished. FotoFlo also seems to keep the sink drains clean. A bottle of FotoFlo lasts a very long time.
Click to expand...

Because it is reusable many times. Besides we need to keep the cost of surfactants down because people think it is so damned expensive that they will use dish washing soap instead! If I reuse PhotoFlo 200 or 600 I can get a few dollars worth of chemicals to last for centuries!
 

Punker

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As I understand it the final rinse water containing the wetting agent will grow mold if reused and left for a time. With only a few drops needed each time I have never found reason to reuse the rinse water but I can see it being handy for one developing session. I’ve reused Xtol 1:1 before and it worked fine.

Unless you’re talking about the bottle of concentrate having sediment in the bottom, in which case I would call the retailer and ask for a refund or exchange. I’ve been using the same bottle of Arista Wetting Agent for over 2 years and haven’t had that issue at all.
 

Sirius Glass

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You can get more use out of XTOL, a lower cost, and better tonality by using replenished XTOL instead of 1:1.
 

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Hmm. Never heard that before. I use Mirasol 2000 and mix it to about 1:400 in a tupperware container where I dunk my film for a couple of minutes before hanging it to dry. I reuse it until there are too many floaties in the water for my personal comfort (though it is still functioning fine as a wetting agent) at which point I mix up another batch. If it gets moldy I have never seen it nor have any of my negatives developed any mold and I have been doing it this way for a while now. I am pretty sure it is antibacterial and antifungal so this should not be an issue. I'll bet that Photo Flow has very similar properties.

I used to put a couple drops into each tank at the end of developing but it took too long to rinse the reels and tank so I started doing it the way I do it now. Either way is fine I imagine and I am pretty sure my little bottle of Mirasol will go a very long time with either method.

BTW - My bottle of Mirasol is black so it could have lots of sediment built up in it by now and I would have no idea. I doubt it will have any affect on the wetting properties.
 

Sirius Glass

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Sirius Glass said:
You can get more use out of XTOL, a lower cost, and better tonality by using replenished XTOL instead of 1:1.
Click to expand...

Punker said:
Awesome. I’m aware of replenishment but I don’t know how to actually go about doing it.
Click to expand...

Mix 5 liters XTOL and store in 1 liter bottles. Label one bottle as replenished XTOL and the rest as Stock. Each time the replenished XTOL is used add 70ml of Stock into the replenished XTOL and then empty the development tank in to the replenished XTOL dumping the excess. Keep air squeezed out of each bottle.

I have kept replenished XTOL going for years.
 
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peter k.

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Ok.. called Freestyle, and they stated that over time it will go bad, because of its interaction with air, .. inside the bottle, even with the lid on tight. They suggested not to use, and throw it away.
Don't need any new photo supplies at this time, and for a $4.19 item, it would cost me $5.99 to ship. Get real! They have a minimum shipping fee, which is understandable, but not happy.

So new question....
Its just a wetting agent, that allows a uniform drying of the film, so one does not get spots on the negative.
We have hard water, and we process with that hard water and then use this Photo Flow that has been mixed in distilled water, in a separate container, and use this as our last step in developing.
It has worked very well all these years, and do not have any spots on the film.
Is there anyway to test this Photo Flow,?
As we understand it, Its just a wetting agent?
Or is there something else that is going on, that if it went bad, it can effect the negative in a harmful way over time?

Heck, we could, get a coffee filter, and to get the couple of drops we need, by soaking the filter, till it dripped, and when we made another order to them or someone else, order some new. .
 

jim appleyard

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Odd, I've never had a wetting agent go bad and I'm working with two bottles that I inherited from photographer friends who have passed away. Both bottles are open and one is 10 years old, the other 20. They are both Kodak Photo-Flo. I've also got an open bottle of Ilford's version that is several years old, open and fine.
 

MattKing

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Bet those bottles were either glass or really good quality plastic .....
 

R.Gould

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Got a 1 litre of Agfa Agepon wetting agent, made by Agfa long before agfaphoto went south and it is fine, liter goes a long way at 1/100 or thereabouts, I have never, in 59 or more years of developing film
Richard
 

Pioneer

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You know, Freestyle sells Arista EDU products and I would expect that they know their own product best.

If they recommended that you dispose of it and buy something newer they may know something that we don't.

I usually try to follow the manufacturer's recommendation, particularly when it comes to chemicals I intend to use on my film negatives or prints. I have never been misled by doing this. Unfortunately there have been times when I have been misled by internet forum wisdom, well meaning or not.

Its your money and your film but I can't believe that buying a new bottle of wetting agent will bankrupt anyone.
 
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peter k.

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Yep, agree with ya Dan, but me nose got out of joint.. Ha... so what!
Still can't understand how a wetting agent could go bad, but it is what it is, and we tossed it.
Then over the weekend took three B&W 4x5 shots and decided to try Taco style in my double 35mm tank.for the heck of it. Ahhhh... well.. not quite enough developer of 24oz, which is suppose to fill the tank, but the top edge of two of them had the wavy tell tale of uneven development. But it was interesting as one of them, it looked like a wavering cloud in the sky.

Soooo meanwhile, for a while, in the back of my mind, been a thinking about the Sp-445 4x5 developing tank... it develops four 4x5's, and uses only 16oz, ...soooo, ordered that, and got over my head ache, and ordered some Kodak 200 PhotoFlo instead of the dead other.
Ha.. Next.. happy man.
Looks like the big hunking 4x5 is gonna take top dog sport, over the other two MF's again.
 

Pioneer

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I use the Jobo 2509 and the Stearman Press 445 tanks to develop my 4x5 film. They both work great but the SP-445 is easier to load. I have to go into the bathroom and close the door to load film in my Jobo reels, I can just use my changing bag to load film into the Stearman Press tank. Way easier to do. The other thing I like about the SP-445 is that I can use it to develop 4x5 photo paper as well as film. Can't do that in the Jobo reel as there is not enough support for the paper when it gets wet.
 
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