Anyone using Xtol with their Jobo?

[Deleted member 19578]

I'm trying to set up some developing times for Xtol with my Jobo CPE and I'm running into some differing starting times on Kodak's & the Massive Dev Chart's sites... As an example Kodak suggests Plus-X @ 125 for 8.25 minutes & MDC suggests 7.25. For Tri-X @400 Kodak says 9 minutes MDC says 8 minutes.

Which should I trust as a starting point? I'm not sure the MDC is taking into account the use of the Jobo, so maybe the Kodak chart is more correct?

 

[Peter De Smidt]

Doesn't Kodak publish the times for rotary processing in their Xtol info? If so, and assuming you have an accurate thermometer, I'd follow Kodak's suggested time as a starting point. I've used Xtol in a Jobo for years, and my times have always been pretty close to Kodak's recommendation.

 

[fschifano]

In the absence of manufacturer's recommendations, the MDC can be a good starting point. But remember that a good portion of the information presented in the MDC comes from individual contributors. Sometimes the numbers agree with the manufacturer's recommendations, often it does not. Given an unknown and untested film and developer combination, I've always found that the manufacturer's recommendations get me very close to the ideal result. If it is not supplied, then I'll check the MDC and use that as a starting point. In the case of Kodak films and developers, I would not even look at the MDC. Kodak's numbers are very good thanks in no small part to the company's extensive R&D program. Go with the Kodak numbers to start.

 

[Deleted member 19578]

Well, I'm going to start with the Kodak times & do a few tests.

Thanks for the input!

 

[Robert Budding]

Sensible. I like the approach Paul Butzi uses - he develops Zone VIII exposures at 3 different times and then plots density as a function of time. That makes it very easy to determine development for differing contrast. More info here, if you're interested:

http://www.butzi.net/articles/tuning1.htm

 

[df cardwell]

Butzi gives a very clear summary of the testing process one can use with XTOL. The work that Kodak did when they prepared the XTOL data was superb, and a photographer today is justified in a new form of calibration.

Instead of assuming there is no data for either the film or developer, and starting from scratch,
assume EKC gave you great information and YOUR job is to see how your exposure meter, thermometer,
and other variables, differs from THEIRS !

Here is a neat resource, a German Kodak XTOL pdf still online,
(the original edition) with both full dilution data AND a remarkable set of curves, at the end of the document.
While there WILL be some variation with constant agitation,
this is well worth a look. I have never had problems with 1+2 dilution, and 1+3 might be very good with a JOBO.

http://wwwfr.kodak.com/AT/plugins/acrobat/de/professional/xtolEntwickler.pdf

 

[hal9000]

I also used the Butzi/Picker method, establish your 0.1 D at Zone I for IE and then VIII exposure for development time. I use the CPP-2 and XTOL 1:3 (with a 5 min pre-wash) and usually have times about 20% less than the Kodak recommended ones. For the new TMAX-400 (TMY2) I have standardized at 7.5 minutes.

 

[Peter De Smidt]

1+3 works very well. If you try this, make sure to have 100ml of xtol stock for each 36 exposure roll of film that you use.

There's no need to use a pre wash. Jobo generally recommended a pre-wash only because using a 5 minute one allowed people to use the standard inversion times and get very close to the right development. Per Jobo's Ricki Stauffer and Ken Owen there is no quality advantage to using a prewash. And they specifically said that there's no point to using one with Xtol since Kodak did the work figuring out rotary times.