Anyone have a soft spot for complete strangers?

[JMC1969]

I got my first 4x5 (Toyo view) about three months ago without a lens. I have been saving and shopping (ebaying, classifieds) every since. I managed to save any extra $250 to spend on a good deal. I just got kicked in the face!!! I owed $1600 in taxes today. Needless to say, most of my lens money is gone now, so If anyone now is weeping a little, shedding a tear or two, or just flat out bawling over my story and has a good lens on the cheap, please respond. I going to go pet my lensless 4x5 now and stare at my computer for replies.

Thank You, your very kind.

Jody

 

[JMC1969]

[/IMG]

 

[removed account4]

you might try poking around
equinoxphotographic.com
they have nice lenses and great
prices. they are nice folks too

john

 

[jimgalli]

Tape some aluminum foil to the back of the board you're holding and push a pin through the foil. Bingo, really cheap lens. No glass to clean.

 

[David Brown]

Increase your withholding.

 

[keithwms]

I could part with a schneider 210 symmar-s 5.6 for say $300. It doesn't cover 5x7, which annoys me greatly because that is what I am using mostly now. But for 4x5 it's a winner and a super starting lens.

Okay that's my "high end" offer.

My low end offer would be a tominon 135 f/4.5 enlarging lens (no shutter) which can be hand shuttered to give good results in 4x5. That I would part with for shipping costs of, say, $10.

My recommendation would be to fit your camera with an enlarging lens, you'll be pleasantly surprised. They are inexpensive and normally quite fast. You can pick 'em up for almost nothing. Who needs a shutter. Shoot ISO 25 film while we still have it. Hell, you can shoot to paper if finances are that tight.

 

[epatsellis]

My recommendation would be to fit your camera with an enlarging lens, you'll be pleasantly surprised. They are inexpensive and normally quite fast. You can pick 'em up for almost nothing. Who needs a shutter. Shoot ISO 25 film while we still have it.

Or for even slower film (EI 6) Ultrafine Direct Positive Dupe Film, around $1/8x10 sheet in 25 sheet packages.


erie

 

[JMC1969]

$300 is just out of my price range at the moment but thanks for the offer. I have access to lots of enlarger lens from work. I thought it would be a bit tricky getting times right without a shutter. I have planned for some outdoor/daytime shooting. How would you go about doing that anyway? Lens cap? and won't that effect the sharpness of the image even on a longer exposure time? (The removal and replacement of the cap that is)

I could part with a schneider 210 symmar-s 5.6 for say $300. It doesn't cover 5x7, which annoys me greatly because that is what I am using mostly now. But for 4x5 it's a winner and a super starting lens.

Okay that's my "high end" offer.

My low end offer would be a tominon 135 f/4.5 enlarging lens (no shutter) which can be hand shuttered to give good results in 4x5. That I would part with for shipping costs of, say, $10.

My recommendation would be to fit your camera with an enlarging lens, you'll be pleasantly surprised. They are inexpensive and normally quite fast. You can pick 'em up for almost nothing. Who needs a shutter. Shoot ISO 25 film while we still have it. Hell, you can shoot to paper if finances are that tight.

 

[JMC1969]

I thought Kodak quit making all their dupe film?

Or for even slower film (EI 6) Ultrafine Direct Positive Dupe Film, around $1/8x10 sheet in 25 sheet packages.


erie

 

[JMC1969]

I will have to do some research on pin hole.

Tape some aluminum foil to the back of the board you're holding and push a pin through the foil. Bingo, really cheap lens. No glass to clean.

 

[epatsellis]

I thought Kodak quit making all their dupe film?

www.ultrafineonline.com, their own brand of dupe film, cheap, ortho and quite nice:

erie

 

[rwyoung]

Photo paper as film. Nice and slow, maybe ISO 4 to ISO 8. Much more UV sensitive of course. But you can do some neat stuff! In addition to the Ultrafine house brand, there is APHS from FreestylePhoto.

Or if you use "real" film, add a ND filter behind the lens to knock down the ISO one or two stops. Or learn to love black skys and keep a RED filter on all the time.

Make an extra lens cap of a few layers of tinfoil with some black paint or paper inside. Size this so it fits loosely-snug (if that makes sense) over the lens. Now you can remove and replace with out turning the camera into a bobble head doll. After you put back the dark slide you can replace the real lens cap for some physical protection.

Or google around here or over at LF forum for Jim Galli's two dark slide shutter trick. It works with a little practice. You can use cardboard or the thin basswood plywood used for model planes. Paint it black first.

You can make your camera a pinhole camera, make two pinholes, one "large" for viewing and composing and one small for picture makin'. Good combination with the RC photo paper as negative idea.

Or you can make some single element lenses. Easy to do. There is a thread over at LF forum with a title like "new lenses from China" or some such. And there used to be an article in the free section of ViewCamera.com about making lens assemblies. Don't know if it is still there.

And as for the tax thing... Well you can have my sympathy for the LF camera issues but there is such a thing as tax planning. Sounds harsh to say after your little episode but I've worked the last decade as self-employed (or as I liked to call it, self-unemployed) and I've spent more than my fair share of time and money figuring out how to manage the (unfair) tax and health-care systems.

 

[keithwms]

I thought it would be a bit tricky getting times right without a shutter. I have planned for some outdoor/daytime shooting. How would you go about doing that anyway? Lens cap? and won't that effect the sharpness of the image even on a longer exposure time? (The removal and replacement of the cap that is)

You can accurately time down to 1/16 or so quite easily, if you are musically inclined

But 1/2 sec to long exposures are trivial. Here's what I do. I took an old darkslide and put on some of that stick-on black felt material from a crafts store. I take off the lens cap (with the film darkslide still in place covering the film). Then I cover the lens with my felt cap, withdraw the film darkslide, and release pressure on the felt cap so that it is barely contacting the lens... then the camera won't recoil when I withdraw it. Then I count up my rhythm for a few seconds and then take the shot.

The trick is to use the felt's ability to block the light without applying strong pressure to the lens- that way you can withdraw it without recoil. Whether you do this single-slide felt thing or the two-slide thing, you have to prevent recoil.

You could also use a big, black hat if you feel so inclined. Or a cape. Whatever suits your wardrobe.

I have been using this tactic with all manner of shutterless lenses. No big deal at all. The quickest exposure I feel confident with is 1/8 or so. But you shouldn't get too bent out of shape over a stop or two, if you're shooting b&w print film. If you're shooting to paper then you really don't need a shutter at all. You're looking at 2 sec exposures at least and, anyway, you will be developing by inspection. For that matter, why not shoot to [slow] ortho film and you can also develop by inspection. Who cares if the exposure is off by a few stops.

Another thing you can do is rig an enlarging lens to a press shutter, sometimes they are inexpensive. Actually now that I think of it, I have such a shutter for the tominon, the pair were off an MP-4 camera. It claims speeds to 1/125.

 

[k_jupiter]

Just how handy are you with a drill, saw, clamps, etc?

I could spot you a Packard shutter and a lens that will cover 4x5. 180mm Tessar or so...

Gets you in the ball park. How are you fixed for sheet film holders?

tim in san jose

 

[JMC1969]

Wow,okay it has been busy since I left last night. Thanks to all, if I have time today I am going to do my research on the pin hole and films/papers.

As far as the enlarging lenses go, I came to work a little early and went through two boxes of lenses (about 30) ranging from 50mm to 150mm. Rodenstock, schneiders, nikkor, all good lenses and I will have to check my other lens board before I get too upset about it, but I brought in my standard board and my recessed board (both have about a 34-35mm hole) and none of the lenses fit. I know the other board has a bigger hole but not sure of the size (after lunch I will) I really don't want to mess with altering one of the lens boards because I'm not to sure how hard they are to come by. I may have to at some point just to get started. You guys have me pretty pumped up about trying this method.

My concern with the lens cap (big black hat) was movement in the camera while removing and replacing ,but, also the motion in front of the lens. Does that not effect the sharpness as well? Either way I am going to try something in the next couple of days if I can fit something to a lens board.

 

[Steve Hamley]

I have some glass cells if you want for shipping. No iris, no shutter. But you play around with cardboard or PVC "barrels" and shoot wide open using the old "hat shutter"

Cheers,

Steve

 

[JMC1969]

Well I was a custom woodworker (mostly furniture) for about fifteen years before I got back to the roots of photography size of things so I think I should be pretty well off with a drill (press), saw (I have more than I need of all types) and clamps (never enough clamps). I had replied right above this that I am a little reluctant to mess with my lens boards, but maybe I could make one of wood. Sheet film holders I feel I have quite a few, I got 12 with the camera, so 24 sheets and I still have a small dark bag from ages ago so I can just take a couple of boxes with me.

Thanks

Just how handy are you with a drill, saw, clamps, etc?

I could spot you a Packard shutter and a lens that will cover 4x5. 180mm Tessar or so...

Gets you in the ball park. How are you fixed for sheet film holders?

tim in san jose

 

[jimgalli]

My first choice with an enlarging lens would be Schneider Componon-S. They are plasmats and I've used 135 and 150's as taking lenses. They're wonderful for that.

Checkout Freestyle Photo's APHS orthochromatic film. I have a page at my website with a formula for continuous tone with that film. Very cheap and microscopic grain. Make sure you get the box that's cut expressly for 4X5 holders. It's asa 3 so in bright sun about f22 1/2 gives an easy 3 seconds iirc. Easily done with a lens cap.

Lens cap exposures, I pull the cap loose and hover micromillimeters in front of the lens while the camera settles down, then move quickly out of the way. Jiggle all you want putting it back on.

Another tip, the Schneider Componon 135 and 150 cells will come right out of the barrel and spin into a Copal 0 shutter with no machine work required. Tektronics Polaroid used to sell a little crt camera called C4 that has a useable Copal 0 shutter. Sometimes you can get them for + or - $25 on ebay.

 

[John Koehrer]

Drill press? Dude, you are so prepared to make lens boards.
I usually use aircraft ply from the local hobby emporium.
In making them I've used two sheets of the appropriate thickness & glue them together. Inner piece is smaller & gluing them up was easier than rabbeting the edge.

 

[keithwms]

Don't worry of your enlarging lens doesn't fit the hole in your lensboard. Go ahead and laugh but I have attached lensboards to lensboards with velcro or just electrical tape. Whatever. At some point you will learn to love the handyman resourcefulness and the Amish straight-forwardness that is inherent to LF! It's not like small or medium format where you expect somebody to sell you a fancy solution for kilodollars when you can take duct tape and make your own attractive one-of-a-kind masterpiece!

Look, in a pinch, I've made quite useful lensboards using a piece of wood or metal and a dremel tool. Almost everybody in LF does such things at some point!

I don't remember what I paid for the MP-4, it is similar to the crt camera that Jim mentioned. It came with the tominon and the copal shutter. I think I paid maybe $50 for it. I was after the reflex viewer and the shutter so I considered it a good deal.

Look out for the poco wooden field cameras- they come with quite decent lenses that are bulb-shuttered just like the "modern" packards. I got one gem with a king poco that turned out to be a very nice convertible lens, a really sweet deal.

 

[darinwc]

Sounds like your lensboards are both copal 0 sized.
I have a couple things i could send you for copal 1 size.

calumet caltar 210mm f5.6 with a chip in the rear cell. I masked off the chip and it actually works well like this. The front cell is undamaged and you can use just the single element as well.

tominon 127mm f4.7 elements. excellent lenses.

I dont have a spare shutter but I think I can send you a size 1 barrel. You will have to figure out the f-stops and use a hat or crafted lens cap for timing.

do you need a film holder?

let me know.
darin

 

[JMC1969]

Okay, so I have returned with my other lens board and it's hole measured at about 42mm. I found one enlarging lens out of the bunch that will fit and it is a EL-NIKKOR 135mm1:5.6. So maybe I will be able to do a lens cap trick this weekend.

I was hoping to use the Rodenstock Rodagon 150mm and may still get there, but I will have to make those lens boards first. I think I remember reading that some lens boards are not drilled with the hole on center. If not, what is the degree off of center and what is it's propose for being off center?

 

[jimgalli]

I think I remember reading that some lens boards are not drilled with the hole on center. If not, what is the degree off of center and what is it's propose for being off center?

Does the same thing as rise and fall. Gives that little bit more that some of the smaller cameras need. 42mm is Copal 1 so you're smart not to disturb that one. It'll come in handy for your 210mm when you find one.

 

[JMC1969]

My first choice with an enlarging lens would be Schneider Componon-S.

Another tip, the Schneider Componon 135 and 150 cells will come right out of the barrel and spin into a Copal 0 shutter with no machine work required. Tektronics Polaroid used to sell a little crt camera called C4 that has a useable Copal 0 shutter. Sometimes you can get them for + or - $25 on ebay.

The only Componon-S I came up with was a 50mm, I don't imagine that is going to work. I found a Schneider Componar 105mm that will hold in my standard board by itself, but will it fit into a shutter?

Better question! Does anyone have a web page that gives the info on what size hole is needed for each kind of shutter?

 

[jimgalli]

The only Componon-S I came up with was a 50mm, I don't imagine that is going to work. I found a Schneider Componar 105mm that will hold in my standard board by itself, but will it fit into a shutter?

Better question! Does anyone have a web page that gives the info on what size hole is needed for each kind of shutter?

The 50's no good. You could have some fun with the 105 though if you like product shot kind of distances. Componar's are actually rated for more latitude than some of the others. Those used to get sold to police stations on finger print cameras as well as serving as an enlarger lens. Don't know of any web pages like that. You'll just have to get GAS and buy a bunch of stuff like the rest of us. :rolleyes: