Anyone Else, weird - remnant Lower Pipe Chem Smells?

Rrrgcy · Jul 31, 2023

Trying to root out the source of some distinct rude chem-like smells. They smell sort of kinda like that, but I’ve ruled anything else out. Embarrassingly, I’m suspecting chem smells linger - like Forever in pipes?

Chems are * hypo, photoflo, developer, stop, and numerous 8x11 trays of contaminated water changes from fix rinsing and also numerous selenium toning fix contaminated water changed trays rinsing, and many many 5x7” size trays of in-between rinsing contaminated with developer, stop, and fix. Note that I use a lot of water rinsing as I enjoy matte FB paper and found the fix/selenium fix smells tended to stay in the paper unless I did a lot of clean water soaking and rinsing (which hence become contaminated and dumped). So I do it between stages as well.

So I’ll ask if anyone has had experience with darkroom duties done dirty upstairs and washing chems down the plumbing, in my case the smells seem now to perpetually emanate from the downstairs laundry tub and adjacent bathroom sink area (other side of the wall) - I believe my plumbing routes down that way. It makes sense the areas smell the same.

I only do darkroom work once a month or so, perhaps qty. 35 5x7”s, four hrs worth of effort, and wonder if it’s possible that despite post-rinsing the sinks and tub upstairs w follow-on Mistolene (sort of like a lavender Lysol) and more water down the pipes, is it possible chems somehow still linger or grow mold or something which won’t wash out?

MattKing · Jul 31, 2023

Sounds to me like a plumbing problem, not a problem with the chemicals themselves.
I'm not a plumber, but I'd suspect issues with the venting.

koraks · Aug 1, 2023

MattKing said:
I'd suspect issues with the venting.

That's one area to look into. Or more obviously, a clogged drain that's not quite as bad as to cause overflows, but it's getting there.

When flushing toilets or draining tubs etc., are there any sounds that point towards plumbing problems? Gurgling sounds? Other drains making sounds as you drain e.g. the tub/flush the toilet? Does everything drain rapidly or does it take a while?

Rrrgcy said:
distinct rude chem-like smells

I'm not sure what that means, exactly. Ammonia smells? Acetic acid smells? Phenolic smells? Sulfur dioxide smells? Oxidized sulfite smells? Something else?
Can you describe the smell a little more precisely? Are you sure it's darkroom-related?
And no, those darkroom smells generally don't linger in the pipes unless there's a massive plumbing problem that allows the chemistry to somehow collect somewhere - e.g. a leak behind a wall or underneath a floor, and your chemistry basically washes into an area of the house where you've not found it (but the smell is there).
Follow the trajectory of the pipes and check for moisture spots.

Rick A · Aug 1, 2023

By any chance, do you have a floor drain in the basement? If so, you may want to make sure you pour water into it on a regular basis to keep the trap from drying out and allowing sewer gas to escape into the room. This is a common problem with older homes.

Sirius Glass · Aug 1, 2023

I think it is a plumbing and vent problem.

ic-racer · Aug 1, 2023

I don’t know the local building codes in ‘So Fl’ but are you sure you have a trap ( s-bend ) in your drains.

snusmumriken · Aug 1, 2023

I agree with previous comments. Check the U-bends in laundry and bathroom areas for partial blockages. If anyone in your household has long hair, you could have rat-sized clots of hair, holding foul-smelling cultures of yuk.

chuckroast · Aug 1, 2023

Rrrgcy said:
Trying to root out the source of some distinct rude chem-like smells. They smell sort of kinda like that, but I’ve ruled anything else out. Embarrassingly, I’m suspecting chem smells linger - like Forever in pipes?

Chems are * hypo, photoflo, developer, stop, and numerous 8x11 trays of contaminated water changes from fix rinsing and also numerous selenium toning fix contaminated water changed trays rinsing, and many many 5x7” size trays of in-between rinsing contaminated with developer, stop, and fix. Note that I use a lot of water rinsing as I enjoy matte FB paper and found the fix/selenium fix smells tended to stay in the paper unless I did a lot of clean water soaking and rinsing (which hence become contaminated and dumped). So I do it between stages as well.

So I’ll ask if anyone has had experience with darkroom duties done dirty upstairs and washing chems down the plumbing, in my case the smells seem now to perpetually emanate from the downstairs laundry tub and adjacent bathroom sink area (other side of the wall) - I believe my plumbing routes down that way. It makes sense the areas smell the same.

I only do darkroom work once a month or so, perhaps qty. 35 5x7”s, four hrs worth of effort, and wonder if it’s possible that despite post-rinsing the sinks and tub upstairs w follow-on Mistolene (sort of like a lavender Lysol) and more water down the pipes, is it possible chems somehow still linger or grow mold or something which won’t wash out?

Find a plumber who can televise the inside of the your sewers and chop out any growth in the sewer line that could impede drain flow. This is a common problem with older underground sewer tiles made of clay. They leak slightly and the nutrient-rich sewer water promotes branches and other vegetation growing inside the sewer line.

Trust me, the $300 or so you spent is worth it. I have seen two recent examples of sewers backing up - one an underground clay tile sewer, and the other, and overhead PVC system. The underground system clogged due to growth inside the pipe as described above and overflowed into a basement via the floor drain. The PVC sewer blocked up because of excessive toilet paper and who knows what else being flushed, and overflowed via the first floor toilet. (NEVER flush anything other than toilet paper down the sewers. Yes, that includes the so-called sewer safe face- and baby wipes. They are just magnets for creating sewer blockage.)

If the odor is only coming from one of the upstairs drains, it may be that the trap for that drain (under the sink) needs a good cleaning.

Rrrgcy · Aug 1, 2023

snusmumriken said:
I agree with previous comments. Check the U-bends in laundry and bathroom areas for partial blockages. If anyone in your household has long hair, you could have rat-sized clots of hair, holding foul-smelling cultures of yuk.

I can’t refine the smell but it’s a sort of analogue to the darkroom smell. It’s slightly different than that which lingers upstairs in the connected bathroom/tub room where I work. We don’t use those upstairs sinks/tub at all (except when I sneak in darkroom work).

Yes there is long hair in the home and that might make sense - the lady uses both downstairs adjacent sinks (bathroom and laundry tub) for “hair washing-colorant-dye” work, so to speak so it’s possible hair is collecting below in an S-trap. We have no basement. There is some gurgling in the wall from upstairs water running.

I’m thinking it’s darkroom related since it only began when I began that, and chem stuff is holding onto semi-clog mukresidue in the lines.

Will buy some liquid anti-mold treatment (if it exists, or something) to wash down the tubes and hope it’ll kill funk and then wash a lot of water down to see if it helps. I’m going to first run the upstairs tub water and dual faucets for like ten minutes to see about a truly first time CLEAN water rinse-down.

MattKing · Aug 1, 2023

Rrrgcy said:
I’m thinking it’s darkroom related since it only began when I began that, and chem stuff is holding onto semi-clog mukresidue in the lines.

Your darkroom residue is just on top of all the muck that is already in the pipes - so you smell it before you smell the muck .
If the pipes are clear, you won't smell anything.

Kino · Aug 1, 2023

If any traps are not vented properly, the water/chemicals flowing down from a upstairs sink can literally suck the trap water out, allowing sewer gas to escape into the house.

There are inexpensive AAV's (air admittance valves) you can place on these traps that do not require outside venting. It's basically an atmospheric check-valve that opens when a vacuum is applied but snaps shut when the rushing water goes by.

Do some research, as there are restrictions, both zoning and practical, as to where they can be installed, but they are a possible solution.

I have one on my basement darkroom sink, as it cannot be vented to the outside due to location and it would gurgle and drain poorly without the device.

Dwayne Martin · Aug 1, 2023

Could be you already have an AAV under the sink and that is what is failing and allowing sewer gas in the room. They also call them Studor vents. It has sort of a check valve that can harden and not seal well. Happens from time to time…

Rrrgcy · Aug 1, 2023

Gentleman (I presume), thank you for the detail re plumbing Vents. I think I only have plain tube underneath (incl the rear of the standup sink). Have a wonderful Turkish plumber here who’s the go-to guy and will reach out if massive flood dumping doesn’t clear the smell. For visual, am dealing with these two which share the common wall in between (they’re essentially back-to-back).

MattKing · Aug 2, 2023

Venting is usually/often only visible if you open the walls.

mshchem · Aug 2, 2023

Kino said:
If any traps are not vented properly, the water/chemicals flowing down from a upstairs sink can literally suck the trap water out, allowing sewer gas to escape into the house.

There are inexpensive AAV's (air admittance valves) you can place on these traps that do not require outside venting. It's basically an atmospheric check-valve that opens when a vacuum is applied but snaps shut when the rushing water goes by.

Do some research, as there are restrictions, both zoning and practical, as to where they can be installed, but they are a possible solution.

I have on on my basement darkroom sink, as it cannot be vented to the outside due to location and it would gurgle and drain poorly without the device.

+1,+2, +3. I would bet have vent problems, traps that aren't working properly. Floor drains and unused bathes or showers could be letting stinky sewer smells into your home. I have Oatley air admittance valves on my big sinks they work great.

Rrrgcy · Aug 12, 2023

Okay problem solved.

It was a damn semi hidden 5-lb. bag of potatoes that molded and spoiled. It lay in the corner near the laundry under some rough clothes. This had been going on for two+ months. If you knew the number of bottles of Mistolene, vinegar, laundry detergent and barrels full of water down the drains from upstairs and down to try to clear the suspect stuff.
In the garbage - now the can smells.

thanks so much for advice.

Kino · Aug 12, 2023

Ah, the "tater syndrome"! Bet that was stinky!

koraks · Aug 12, 2023

Rrrgcy said:
It was a damn semi hidden 5-lb. bag of potatoes that molded and spoiled.

Oh boy, that can reek really badly! I can relate. Had a similar issue years ago. Glad you got it solved and it involved no intervention apart from a bit of localized cleaning!

pentaxuser · Aug 12, 2023

Rrrgcy said:
Okay problem solved.

Well done That's $300 dollars and a plumber saved

pentaxuser

MattKing · Aug 12, 2023

See - doing darkroom work even helps your home smell better

.

snusmumriken · Aug 13, 2023

Always good to shift the blame to another department!

Sirius Glass · Aug 13, 2023

Rrrgcy said:
Okay problem solved.

It was a damn semi hidden 5-lb. bag of potatoes that molded and spoiled. It lay in the corner near the laundry under some rough clothes. This had been going on for two+ months. If you knew the number of bottles of Mistolene, vinegar, laundry detergent and barrels full of water down the drains from upstairs and down to try to clear the suspect stuff.
In the garbage - now the can smells.

thanks so much for advice.

I am glad that you found the source of the problem. Now go and shoot more film.

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