• Welcome to Photrio!
    Registration is fast and free. Join today to unlock search, see fewer ads, and access all forum features.
    Click here to sign up

Anybody using one of these for 4X5 film processing?

MattKing said:
Has anyone tried to use one of these in a Paterson tank for rotary processing?
Click to expand...

I have not, but I've thought about it pretty hard.

A few years ago I posted this: http://photo.net/large-format-photography-forum/00RMar

and this: (there was a url link here which no longer exists)

And when I first saw the eBay listing I sent the guy a message with the link saying I was very interested in his work.

The most likely issue I see with the current design is that as the unit turns in fluid it will generate a lot of drag on the edges, especially the corners. The Phototherm design compensates by having a support bar there, as well as the fact that the film curl on the Phototherm places the film in a better circle so that the leading edge acts in a more knife-like fashion rather than a hydroplane.

One issue Photohterm warns of with 120 film is that the rotating action of the processor can pull the film out of the grooves, so they have a little clip that holds the film tail in place. (Works great BTW.)

The Phototherm 4x5 adapter handles this with the plastic frame bar that holds the leading edge of the film as it turns in the fluid.

The current design on eBay - since it's not designed for rotary processing - doesn't take this into account. I expect that the film will come loose in the tank unless the rotation is pretty slow. I doubt it would take much more than two bands around the top and bottom edge to fix the problem (if it even is a problem), but that's more material and machining driving the cost up.

I approached Phototherm a few years ago about producing their adapters for the hobby market. While they were interested, the final decision was that it wasn't profitable. They even offered to rent the molds to me so I could produce them myself, but after crunching numbers I didn't pursue it either. A production run large enough to get the cost down to my target of < 20USD, so that they could be sold for 25USD was around 10K units. Smaller production runs cost more per unit, obviously.

Maybe the market has changed, and a higher production cost is feasible. And there's no harm in the fact that the guy on eBay has twice the volume capacity of the Phototherm unit. (6 sheets vs Phototherm's 4 sheets)

As far as his plan to a 5x7 unit, I've done quite a bit of measuring, and you can easily interleave 2 sheets of 5x7 into the same volume. As for 8x10, an adapter that's properly made could fit two sheets of 8x10 into a Paterson 5 reel tank. But by then you're talking about a lot of fluid to slosh around. But one made for a Phototherm could do 2 sheets of 8x10 in an SSK8 tank.

MB
 
Last edited by a moderator:

Well Mike, I agree that loading this thing in a changing bag looks like it would be a real PITA. But for me, tank processing offers advantages in temperature control that I just find too difficult to maintain when working with open trays. The ambient temperature of my darkroom varies wildly as the seasons change. With open trays, so does the developer temperature. With tank processing, it's an easy thing to set the whole works into a tempering bath. I'm currently using an HP CombiPlan tank for 4x5 sheet film and I'm happy with it. For those who don't already have or for some reason don't like that tank, this device could offer an alternative. It should use about the same amount of chemistry as the HP, and while it is a bit more than you might need in an open tray, it is not terribly excessive.
 
Andrew_M said:
... using a changing bag and daylight safe combi tank ...
Click to expand...

I don't even think a changing bag is required. While I'm lucky enough (meaning old and gray-haired) to have a small permanent darkroom, even in my youth I just loaded in a closet. I'm sure there are some who can't do this. But don't let lack of a changing bag stop you. Finding a dark place isn't that difficult.

I have a changing bag, and if I need to do something while out and about it works. But I found the hall closet is dark, and far less confining.
 

I load my Patersons in the wine cellar. No windows, light tight. Just ordered one of these. Thanks for the link.
 
Did up a little video here as people were curious. No affiliation, just a curious Ebay buyer.

No report on consistency yet; I have only used it once so far and had good results. Time will prove whether it's consistent or not. I have plenty of experience with 35mm and 120 on the patterson reels, so this is a nice option. I also use the combiplan tank and tray developing.

Here it is in high def.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kjO1VAP5Lr0&hd=1
 
Very cool! Thanks for the link, I'll keep it in mind if my darkroom situation changes. I've had friends who complained about un-even development in yankee style tanks- but this could be a very good alternative for a daylight tank.
 
I was just thinking of putting up a post to ask what you guys used to develop 5x4 as I am planning on having a go. I splashed out on a CombiPlan but its only just arrived so not used it. I was going to ask what experiences you have had with it. Some comments here on that line. I was worried about the time taken to load and empty the Combi so this alternative does look interesting. I don't have a 3 reel Paterson but I do 120 too so a purchase would be ok with me. So thanks for the link and I look forward to more reports on its use and particularly in comparison to the Combi,

Chris
 
My Pro Plates

Hey Guys,

Thanks for all your interest in my Processors.

I'm really up to it shooting fashion week in new york, but will try and answer all the quires and thoughts you guys have had with regards to my processors, in the next few days

Cheers,

Morgan. MOD Photographic.
 
I have used a combi for more than a year. I'd consider the MOD "pro plates" reel to be a competing choice. I'll be keeping both.

They both do the same thing (6 sheets with 1l of chemistry), cost about the same if you figure a used paterson tank with the MOD.

I bought the new MOD reel so I could potentially do 120 or 35mm and 4x5 at the same time (if I only have 1 120, as I have the 5-135 size paterson tank)

However the other day, I had 2 120 rolls to do AND 4x5 film, and my paterson tank isn't big enough for all that, so I ended up using the combi and paterson at the same time. I like my two combi tanks. The combi tanks are slower to fill/drain and a little messier than paterson gear under typical circumstances. Neither issue has any effect on image quality. Both Combi and MOD load wet or dry. (unlike traditional paterson reels, which is why stainless reels are more common in school situations I think, so they can be reused without drying)
 
Interesting new gadget. Will the tops and bottoms of the film stay in place throughout the processing? I'd be a little worried that the flow of chems would cause the sheets to touch. (happens occasionally with my combiplan)
 
With the combiplan, that issue is possible with vigorous agitation. Do a sort of gentle or slow motion agitation and you won't have that problem with the combi again. The film stays very well in place in the MOD reel because of how curved it is.
 
Hello Morgan, and welcome to APUG. Your MOD Photographic Processors are really a great idea.
 
Hi Morgan,

I've got to tell you that your processor works great!!!

For the first time since I took up 4x5 photography, I'm able to get even development.

Best regards,

Dave Held
 
I am used to using 500 mL for ten sheets in an Expert drum, but that is for color only. I process b/w using other methods. This insert for the Patterson tanks really is not all that bad on chemistry. I use at least 250 mL just to process a single sheet in a tray, or 2 whole liters when doing a batch of 8-10 in a deep tank, so it is better than either of these options. The six sheets equal 1.5x80 sq-in, which is not far out of line for that volume of chemistry. While there are better options (such as the SS Nikkor that is as efficient as my Jobo tank), I don't think this is a bad one.
 
Dear All,

I have a day off tomorrow, as i travel to Paris for the final stages of the SS11 fashion shows, if you have any questions about my processors let me know, and I'll answer them.

Cheers,

Morgan.
 
Go for the Nikor tank offered on the first page. They are first class and cost a small fortune new. Maybe $300 in 1960 money.

36 oz chemicals. Prefill the tank and drop the loaded reel in in the dark. pull up and rotate, reimmerse. Do this 4 times in the first minute. Than cap and use a regular daylight tank.
 
MOD_Photographic said:
Dear All,

I have a day off tomorrow, as i travel to Paris for the final stages of the SS11 fashion shows, if you have any questions about my processors let me know, and I'll answer them.

Cheers,

Morgan.
Click to expand...

OK, I'm interested in how well it might hold the film used in a rotary processor like a Phototherm. There is an issue of the film edge pulling out. (I realize you probably don't have access to a Phototherm to test this.) I can see that adding a small piece at the top and bottom corners of the sheets to provide more rigidity so the dynamic fluid pressure doesn't pull the film out might help.

And I'm interested in 5x7. Any concrete plans. I saw you mentioned it, but it takes effort to work out the details. A couple of 5x7 sheets in the same space so that it fits into the same tank would be pretty awesome in my mind.

Michael
 
Good things happen!

I was given a Jobo 2551 tank today. I have some acrylic sheet tucked away and think I might fashion something to fit the tank in a similar style for my 4x5's and see how it goes . . .
 
It's easier to get a Jobo 5x4 reel for a Jobo tank, they sell for lowish prices and hold 6 sheets each. Morgan's reels are for Paterson tanks which have a narrower diameter.

Ian
 
Yep, I will undoubtedly get one of those for the tank - and I just thought it might be fun to customise something for the jobo tank and give it a try. Nothing lost but a little time

Cheers
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Menu
Log in
Register