Any users of Pentax Spotmatic ES II?

[Kodachromeguy]

Hi, are any of you actively using the ES II? I have a regular Spotmatic, but the ES II is tempting. I know about the need for using SMC lenses with the little pin on the back. Almost none of the vendors on the 'Bay have installed batteries and really checked the auto function. Any advice? Thanks!

 

[Paul Howell]

I was tempted by the ES, but bought a Chinon CE 3 with winder, got in the late 70s or early 80s. It's aperture preferred, works by selecting the shutter speed when the shutter is pressed, works with single pin M 42 lens, the winder is not much to write home about, the motor drive for the ES II is much better. The Chinon takes a modern battery, off the top of head don't recall which one it takes. It along with the CM3 were last M 42 bodies Chinon sold as Chinion but continued under the GAF label for while. Or a Chinon Ce4 with K mount and adapter.

 

[Billy Axeman]

Coincidentally I got an ES-II this week and just replaced the seals and added a correction lens to the viewfinder. It is built like a tank, it has a weight of 1000 gr (including SMC Takumar 28mm f/3.5) and it looks fabulous with the heightened bottom plate (for holding the printed circuit board). The shutter sound is loud, which perfectly fits its appearance.

The viewfinder is quite dim (with lens f/3.5), the shutter-time scale (on the right in the viewfinder) is barely visible in bright light, the ground glass is coarse with only a micro prism area. No problems with focusing though.

I got this camera to experiment with the Takumar lenses (28 and 35), but actually I like almost all aspects of it: classic look, solid build, high weight (yes), straightforward operation, standard batteries (4x SR44).

I'm planning a first test roll next week, so I can't say how it works in practice, notably the metering.

Yet highly recommended.

p.s. A quirk of the ES-II is that the light meter only works in Auto, in Manual the meter is off!

 

[mshchem]

Back in the day I had an ES. That was a great camera. I even let it go auto on a tripod night shots of neon signs, etc. I wouldn't buy one that hadn't been checked out. Pentax made great lenses in the day. I have a mint SP-500 with the 8 element 50mm f1.4 Super Takumar loaded with Fujichrome Provia-F. That meter still works great.

 

[Steve Roberts]

Hi,
Depends what you mean by "actively using"! I have an ESII, ES and first of the series the Electro Spotmatic. I don't use them all the time, but from time to time I take each out for a bit of exercise. Not so much this year, of course, for obvious reasons. Mechanically, they are very well built but what let them all down even when relatively new was the electronic circuitry, which was not exactly the last word in reliability. The ESII was the last and probably best of the bunch. That said, most of the faults are fixable. My ESII was giving inconsistent exposures when I bought it but a repairer I used at the time cured the problem and it has been fine ever since (must be about 20 years). The ES had two problems which I found myself - a bad soldered joint and a problem with the electromagnet that (IIRC) releases the second shutter curtain. The Electro Spotmatic also had a bad soldered joint. I think the electronics were basically OK but just not rugged enough.
As has been said, the meter doesn't work in manual mode but you can set it to auto, see what shutter speed is indicated for a given aperture then go back to manual. The marked manual shutter speeds from 1/60th to 1/1000th work independently of the batteries or meter.
Unless the camera has been thoroughly checked by someone who knows what they are doing or it's warranted, I would assume that any of the ES series probably won't work. If you pay accordingly (there are lots of them out there) and it works, so much the better but if it doesn't, have the cash put by for a service/repair. When working properly all are nice cameras to use, delivering remarkably good auto exposures.
Best wishes,
Steve

 

[Bill Burk]

I've have mine since 1980 and it still works and I still use it. Manual speeds up to 1000 don't cap and the electronic speeds are still accurate, never had to touch the electronics though I have had to make sure the contacts on the circuit board were clean.
I have replaced mirror cushion and seals. The winding is a bit stiff.

I use it with Super Takumar lenses as well as SMCT, and am used to "stop-down or else" rigamarole.

Batteries tend to last forever. But I still bring it along because it's the only body that reliably fires at 1000.

 

[Billy Axeman]

As a frequent visitor of PentaxForums (I have half a dozen of Pentax cameras) you get an impression of the reliability of the various models, and the one that is sticking out negatively is the Pentax ME (Super), which has at least one user a month with a question. The other models have far less problems, and actually I can't remember ever having seen problems with the ES or ES-II. Of course these are all old cameras which should receive a CLA (but they are too cheap for it), but I think the ES and ES-II are not especially unreliable. As @Steve Roberts says, the previous model Electro Spotmatic has indeed a very bad reputation, and as a consequence nobody buys it second hand.

 

[Finn lyle]

The ESII is one of my favorite bodies to use. Its crazy heavy and pretty large for a 35mm camera but sometimes that's a virtue for low shutter speed hand-held shots. The worst thing about them is that they suffer from the same mirror lock that the rest of the Spotmatic family has, where the mirror cog under the circuit board gets gummed up. Its a simple fix though, just annoying to deal with. I've actually got a few I've been fixing up which will probably be sold soon, all of which I've been putting film through. It seems to me that they really either work fine or just don't turn on at all. The electronics are lightyears more reliable in the ESII than the ES or especially the dreaded Electro-spot, I've never seen one that can't be brought back to full functionality with just a little cleaning. Even with a non SMC or S-M-C lens the meter is fantastically accurate (using the little stop-down switch to the left of the mount). I agree with Billy that the viewfinder could be brighter but hostly its not too far off from the other Spotmatics. It will take good pictures in low light, I've had an exposure last almost 45 minutes before and it was usable. The build-in viewfinder blind is very useful for that.

 

[Dennis-B]

Found mine at a garage sale. Seller said the camera was "dead" even with new batteries. The camera and 50mm f/1.4 SMC lens. Off the table for $25. Got it home, and figured the lens was worth that. Opened the battery compartment and found the batteries were mis-loaded; realigned them, and the camera works perfectly. Love the lens, too.

 

[Kodachromeguy]

I've never seen one that can't be brought back to full functionality with just a little cleaning.

How do you do the cleaning? Do you mean cleaning the battery contacts or disassembling the body? Thanks!

 

[removedacct3]

A K2 .... does that count?

 

[Finn lyle]

How do you do the cleaning? Do you mean cleaning the battery contacts or disassembling the body? Thanks!

Cleaning the battery contacts if they’re corroded (you’ll know if the battery test button fails), if they’re clean and the electronics are not working pop off the bottom plate and check the two posts which screw into the frame- the one closest to the circuit board connector is a grounding post and can come loose or get funky.
The other issue is mechanical, sometimes the mirror return cog gets gummy from dust and oil mixing and the mirror locks up, especially on auto and slower speeds. With the bottom cover off, remove the three screws holding the motherboard on and gently pull it out of the connector (it might need to be wiggled but should come out easily). There is a mechanism by which an arm cocks the mirror return by raising a lever, and the black cog releases it when you hit the shutter button. A drop of a thin lubricant, sewing machine oil or the like, will free this and return the mirror consistently. Just fire the shutter a few dozen times to work the oil in. This works on all spotmatic series cameras to my knowledge.
Oh- another issue is the switch that pushing down the shutter button turns on, it’s those two metal ribbons above the mirror mechanism. Sometimes the black plastic switch housing (circled in red) gets cracked with age, a drop of super glue in the crack while pushing the plastic together will keep it from getting worse. The bifurcated ribbon that normally doesn’t move can be bent to make contact again while depressing the shutter release. These three issues are probably present on most of the non-working cameras and really aren’t a terrible fix. Sorry if I didn’t explain that well, I’d be happy to give a better explanation if you need it. Hope that helps!

 

[Billy Axeman]

A K2 .... does that count?

The Spotmatic era (with M42 mount) ends in 1973-75 with the ES-II. The K2 is the new generation with K-mount, introduced in 1975 together with the KM and KX.

 

[Kodachromeguy]

Finn, this explanation is awesome. Thank you for taking all that time to post the pictures.

 

[Billy Axeman]

.... With the bottom cover off, remove the three screws holding the motherboard on and gently pull it out of the connector (it might need to be wiggled but should come out easily). ...

The circuit board is connected via the black block on the right side of the photos. Before putting it in again after service clean the contacts on the board (with isopropyl alcohol) because after 45 years they have collected a patina and perhaps dust just outside the small contact area between connector and board. When you put it in again you never catch those small areas again which may result in a heightened electrical resistance.

Also be careful not to bend the board excessively when removed, because the solder joints of the components (a tin/lead alloy) may have become somewhat brittle (crystallized) which can also result in bad contacts. Failures of this type are difficult to pinpoint and occur randomly.

 

[Finn lyle]

Also be careful not to bend the board excessively when removed, because the solder joints of the components (a tin/lead alloy) may have become somewhat brittle (crystallized) which can also result in bad contacts. Failures of this type are difficult to pinpoint and occur randomly.

How could I forget haha. While the ESii does seem to have better soldering quality than say the Electro spot, Billy you’ve really hit the nail on the head. I don’t even know how you’d go about testing all of the dozens of connections on that board. Easy way to kill a good camera I’d say.

 

[Billy Axeman]

How could I forget haha. While the ESii does seem to have better soldering quality than say the Electro spot, Billy you’ve really hit the nail on the head. I don’t even know how you’d go about testing all of the dozens of connections on that board. Easy way to kill a good camera I’d say.

I used the word crystallization, but its officially called 'tin pest' or 'tin disease' and a more complicated process. A good solder point is nice round and smooth and a stricken joint has a matte appearance or matte pits in it so often you can see which ones are bad and you can simply resolder them. It sometimes happens to old stuff in a combination with an inferior lead/tin alloy.

 

[Finn lyle]

Is that at all related to the brittle crystals that give tin its "tin cry"?

 

[Billy Axeman]

Is that at all related to the brittle crystals that give tin its "tin cry"?

No, 'tin cry' is something different.
What I mean is 'Tin pest' https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tin_pest
BTW you don't see it often, but better safe than sorry.

My new ES-II is ready for its first roll but I wait till it stops raining here. I hope end of next week.

 

[Steve Roberts]

As an afterthought to my earlier post, whereas most 35mm SLRs of the 60s & 70s generally came in a chrome finish with black being more unusual, the 'normal' finish for all three ES versions seems to have been black. I can only recall having seen the ESII in chrome finish. Anyone care to comment on whether the Electro Spot and ES were available in chrome? Perhaps the European/US/Far East markets favoured different finishes.
Steve