Any Single Weight Paper still produced?

User Removed · Nov 5, 2005

After printing with single weight AZO for awhile, I have become addicted to printing with single weight paper, and cannot stand to print with double weight anymore! Its just too thick, and looks bad when drymounted.

Besides for Kodak AZO, does anyone know of another single weight paper around today? Kentmore, Ilford, Kodak, Agfa, oriental, ect ect ect?

Thank you kindly,

Ryan

PS-If there is no one still making single weight paper, does anyone have any old stuff they would want to sell?

eumenius · Nov 5, 2005

Well, Slavich company in Russia definitely makes one - but I seriously doubt if you would be able to buy it anywhere out of Russia. It's a classical single-weight, fibre based paper. I wonder why do they still manufacture it

Cheers, Zhenya

User Removed · Nov 5, 2005

eumenius said:
Well, Slavich company in Russia definitely makes one - but I seriously doubt if you would be able to buy it anywhere out of Russia. It's a classical single-weight, fibre based paper. I wonder why do they still manufacture it

Cheers, Zhenya

I think single weight paper is much easier to handle when printing, but the main advantage of single weight paper is if you drymount your prints. Double weight paper sticks up too far from the surface of the mount and you can often see a white line or shadow along the edge, which I really do not like. Single weight paper mounts more flush to the surface of the board and does not stick up as far. This also gives less chance of the edges of the print being chipped ect.

Too bad. I will do a seach for it and see if I can find a place that has any.

Thanks,

Ryan

abeku · Nov 5, 2005

... and Emaks P888 is another one. I haven't seen it for years though. Send a mail to J&C, he's familiar with the Emaks products.

Alex Hawley · Nov 5, 2005

McPhotoX said:
Besides for Kodak AZO, does anyone know of another single weight paper around today? Kentmore, Ilford, Kodak, Agfa, oriental, ect ect ect?

I feel the same Ryan. I was just getting in to using single weight Kodak Polymax Fine Art fiber when it was discontinued last year. At that time I did a search of the internet suppliers in the USA and came with nothing. Would sure like hear if there is some available now.

I'm not sure why single weight got a bad rap so that it didn't sell. Maybe it was mostly do to Ansel Adams saying he preferred double weight, so single weight became magically "inferior". Maybe St Ansel was a little klutzy.

eumenius · Nov 5, 2005

Alex Hawley said:
I'm not sure why single weight got a bad rap so that it didn't sell. Maybe it was mostly do to Ansel Adams saying he preferred double weight, so single weight became magically "inferior". Maybe St Ansel was a little klutzy.

Here, in Russia, no one has read the Sacred Writings of Mr. Adams - the source of bad aura of single-weight paper here is quite simple. No one knew how to dry it without extra-curling of prints, because there were no drying presses or drums available It's still used here for document photography, and the ateliers usually have those huge APSO ferrotyping/drying drums, so single-weight works fine there Not in a regular darkroom, never ever. No one wanted it in the USSR.

Zhenya

Alex Hawley · Nov 5, 2005

That's a good point Zhenya. I wondered if anyone would bring it up. I shied away from fiber paper in general at first because of the curling. But I found that drying the prints face down on screens, then flattening with the dry mount press (or clothes iron and thin mat board), followed by a few days under a stack of books, produced very nice flat prints. I in fact found that single weight was easier to flatten than was double weight. It was just that initial curl upon drying that was more pronounced with single weight.

David A. Goldfarb · Nov 5, 2005

You can coat your own using Strathmore 500 1-ply plate.

Flotsam · Nov 5, 2005

I would definitely be using Kodak Polymax FA SW if it were still available. That was beautiful paper. Nice surface texture, great Blacks and virtually no dry down. Fast to wash and dry. I am missing that stuff,

Alex Hawley · Nov 5, 2005

Flotsam said:
I would definitely be using Kodak Polymax FA SW if it were still available. That was beautiful paper. Nice surface texture, great Blacks and virtually no dry down. Fast to wash and dry. I am missing that stuff,

I have one 25-sheet package left. Been saving it for something special, but don't know what that special thing is yet.

Flotsam · Nov 5, 2005

I'm in the same boat with about a half of a 100 sheet box left. Hope it doesn't go bad while i'm waiting for a worthy project for it.

User Removed · Nov 5, 2005

That is another nice thing about single weight paper. It does not take as long to wash!

People are afraid to handle single weight because it creases and bends easy, but seriously after a day using it, that was no longer a problem. You learn to handle your prints with better care and more gentle. I see students at the university darkroom that grab HUGE stacks of prints out of the trays and just flop them all into a big washer. It drives me nuts to see people handling prints like this!

Ryan

Flotsam · Nov 5, 2005

McPhotoX said:
People are afraid to handle single weight because it creases and bends easy, but seriously after a day using it, that was no longer a problem.

Absolutely. As long as you handle them with the reasonable care that they deserve and don't stab at them with your tongs like you are Norman Bates in "Psycho", the 'more prone to damage' thing is a complete non-issue.

User Removed · Nov 5, 2005

Flotsam said:
Absolutely. As long as you handle them with the reasonable care that they deserve and don't stab at them with your tongs like you are Norman Bates in "Psycho", the 'more prone to damage' thing is a complete non-issue.

HAHAHA! It always kills me to see photographers "stabbing" at their prints with the tongs while in the developer.

Photo Engineer · Nov 5, 2005

In my efforts to locate baryta stock for my hand coatings, I have learned that most major photo paper suppliers are trying to exit the single weight baryta paper business. It is becomeing very difficult to obtain SW FB paper stock.

Lots of DW and HW papers out there as well as RC though. Seems a shame to not have SW FB.

One thing I have learned from my small stock of SW Baryta is that it is much much harder to hand coat on SW than on DW and RC.

One other thing. On coating machines at high speed consider SW FB paper to be like a wet paper towel. This is traveling at a high speed. Imagine how stable the traveling web is and how prone to tears it is. It is much harder to coat SW FB on a coating machine as well just due to physical properties. Due to kinks snd bends during traverse of the machine, coating defects tend to be higher as well.

I too lament the passing of so many SW papers, but I can understand the manufacturing and sales problems associated with these products.

PE

George Papantoniou · Nov 6, 2005

Doesn't Forte make Simple Fortezo (not the "Museum" type) anymore? I guess that the Greek importer of Forte will have some in stock, anyway... It's not so thin, but thinner than regular DW paper anyway. it's something between the SW and the DW you all know.

I would also guess that Kentmere is still producing some type of SW paper ("Bromide" maybe), but the British Apuggers could possibly give us more accurate info on that... The Greek importer of Kentmere might also still have some in stock.

If you want, I can try to find out the available stock ...

kunihiko · Nov 6, 2005

Fuji's multi grade FB paper "fujibromide rembrant VF" is 0.18mm.

abeku · Nov 7, 2005

George Papantoniou said:
... It's not so thin, but thinner than regular DW paper anyway. it's something between the SW and the DW you all know.

Reminds me about Foma's paper Fomatone, a superb paper too!

Denis P. · Nov 7, 2005

abeku said:
... and Emaks P888 is another one. I haven't seen it for years though. Send a mail to J&C, he's familiar with the Emaks products.

Following this info (and finding a half-forgotten box of P888 in my stash), I phoned Fotokemika (manufacturer of Emaks paper and Efke films in Croatia) to ask about their P888 single-weight paper.

The info I got from their sales rep is the following:

Fotokemika doesn't make it any more - last batch was sold some two years ago.
There's simply no demand for it.

HOWEVER, they are quite willing to make it, if anyone orders a minimum quantity of 2.000 square meters of paper. I'm not sure how much that is (translated into boxes of 8x10 paper) - but I'm sure it exceeds my needs

So, if there's enough demand, J&C in USA or Fotoimpex in Germany could order a batch, and Fotokemika will make it - no problem. Of course, it would probably have to be a group effort (a group pre-order?), since we're talking about a rather large batch

It's a very nice paper - I just made some contact prints from my 4x5 negs a couple of days ago, and I immediately framed two of those - I liked them so much

Denis

knutb · Nov 7, 2005

Denis P. said:
HOWEVER, they are quite willing to make it, if anyone orders a minimum quantity of 2.000 square meters of paper. I'm not sure how much that is (translated into boxes of 8x10 paper) - but I'm sure it exceeds my needs
Denis

Should be about 40000 sheets, or 800 boxes of 50 each....

abeku · Nov 7, 2005

Thanks Denis! It's great to have you here at APUG. I suppose the coating of P888 is identical to K888 which makes it to an excellent paper.
For those who are not familiar with Fotokemika, it could be worth mentioned that J&C Expo, Maco Expo and ADOX classic arts also are Emaks K888 paper.
2000 m2 of paper will be around 460 boxes of 18x24/100, I believe

cheers,

mikeg · Nov 7, 2005

George Papantoniou said:
I would also guess that Kentmere is still producing some type of SW paper ("Bromide" maybe), but the British Apuggers could possibly give us more accurate info on that... The Greek importer of Kentmere might also still have some in stock.

Kentmere used to produce Document Art in SW, but have recently changed it to DW. Document Art has a rough surface and no supercoating. I don't think they have any SW papers now.

Mike

Ole · Nov 7, 2005

Denis P. said:
...HOWEVER, they are quite willing to make it, if anyone orders a minimum quantity of 2.000 square meters of paper. I'm not sure how much that is (translated into boxes of 8x10 paper) - but I'm sure it exceeds my needs

So, if there's enough demand, J&C in USA or Fotoimpex in Germany could order a batch, and Fotokemika will make it - no problem. Of course, it would probably have to be a group effort (a group pre-order?), since we're talking about a rather large batch
...

Sounds like a job for Retrophotographic?

I'd like SW paper too. Since I do have a ferrotyping drum which takes up to 16x20", drying FB paper is not a problem at all. Except for the "soft emulsions", which stick to anything.

Stane Kočar · Nov 7, 2005

Denis, do you have last informations about Fotokemika?

Some of my friends have been there three months ago and they told them (in the factory!) that they will end working this December! I've heard rumorus that neighbour's firma have bought the land and the factory.
Can you give me their telephone number?

Regards from Slovenia
Stane Kocar

Denis P. · Nov 7, 2005

Stane Kočar said:
Denis, do you have last informations about Fotokemika?

Some of my friends have been there three months ago and they told them (in the factory!) that they will end working this December! I've heard rumorus that neighbour's firma have bought the land and the factory.
Can you give me their telephone number?

Regards from Slovenia
Stane Kocar

That's the first I've heard...
I phone them every now and then (every two months or so, when I make my orders), and every time I inquire about any new developments (pun intended!)
This morning the guy told me that everything is OK, business as usual.
Seeing that they are one of the last holdouts in analog materials, and that the majority of their production gets sold abroad, they should be doing well. I mentioned to the guy this morning that Ilford is still in business, though, and he said - yeah, but they (Ilford) doubled their prices

So, Fotokemika can always raise the prices, which they will probably have to do, due to increased rates of their suppliers....

Anyway, their phone No. is: +385 1 33 61 133

Regards,

Denis

Any Single Weight Paper still produced?

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eumenius

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Any Single Weight Paper still produced?

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