Any Sinar experts here?

[markbau]

Just wondering what the difference between the C2 and S2 is. I'm assuming the S2 was the top of the range as they are much more expensive. How does the C2 differ?
Thanks for any help.

 

[B.S.Kumar]

I think you mean P2, not S2.
The Sinar is a completely modular camera system, with most components being interchangeable among the various models.
F front standard + P rear standard = C camera.
See this pdf: https://sinar.swiss/assets/Uploads/Sinar-p2c2fcf1-Instruction-Manual-EN.PDF
Here is an overview of the complete system as it existed in 2000-01: https://www.dicam.pl/sites/dicam.pl/files/katalog-sinar-modular-system-en.pdf
Let me know if you need more info.

Kumar

 

[markbau]

Thanks for the links to those brochures, very helpful. Yes, S2 was a typo. From a bit of googling it seems like the P2 is bulkier and some of the knobs lock automatically where as the other models you have to lock them manually.

 

[abruzzi]

the P models (P, P2, P3) have geared movement on all movements, but they are heavy and don't fold up in a way that packs easily. The F series is lighter and folds up in a fairly packable package, and only has geared focus--all the other movements are loosen, slide, then lock. The original F only had geared focus on the rear, the F2 also had geared focus on the front.

 

[MarkS]

The "F" series were Sinar's "field" camera, lighter and more portable than the "P" series,which were thought of as "precision" studio cameras. The "C" was a "combination" model.
You can mix and match pieces and parts to make your perfect device- including the pre-1972 Norma or "standard" cameras as well. Any, and all, of the Sinars are superb photographic tools.

 

[Rockaway Studios]

My experience is that Norma standards don't play well with the F/P/F2/P2 family, because the height from the rail is significantly different. Also, the rail clamp to the the tripod mount is a different height. Other than that, you're right - lens boards, bellows, accessories, even DB shutters work between the two families.

 

[TheFlyingCamera]

There's also the X, which is similar to the P, but lacks the center detent for the shift, and cannot easily be changed to other than 4x5 format.

 

[DREW WILEY]

On the auction site etc all kinds of hybrid combinations show up, often mislabeled, cobbled together from various leftover components. They might work fine, but otherwise could be misleading to potential customers.

Which is the best model depends on what you plan to do. P and X series camera offers the most one-handed adjustment, but at the most bulk and weight; hence they work best in studio situations ample support underneath.

There were multiple F-series, going from the entry level F+ to the more durable later F2.

I've found the old Norma series to be the best compromise between the P's and the F's - just a little heavier than the F2, but a lot more solid. There were two generations of these. The original tapered Norma 4x5 bellows is significantly better than any of the later box bellow; but they're all interchangeable. The key to these older models is finding ones still in good condition.

Then there were the C's, with a P rear standard and F front standard, then a special type of Sinar with fixed right angle standards for sake of art copy work, then a variety of high-tech models, including a servo remote-controlled unit capable of being used in hazardous environments. Then finally, today's micro-geared digital models.

 

[FotoD]

The 8x10 bellows, rear frame and back comes in two sizes; Norma/P vs P2. They do not mix.

The 13x18 backs are not compatible with all rear frames. The locking mechanism changed over time. Try to get parts from the same period.

The compendium holder is not interchangable between Norma and the later models.

As mentioned, it's possible to mix Norma and later standards. But you have to align them manually, and the rise is somewhat limited.

 

[DREW WILEY]

Interchanging compendium shades with the Norma is easy. You just need to file a couple more flats on the connecting rod. With any Sinar, you can use their simple clip system and a spare 4x5 box bellows, even a worn out one, to make your own effective compendium.

The rail diameter is more consistent post-Norma. That won't stop interchangeability, but might make sliding less smooth. Normas have all kinds of built-in fine-tuning adjustments which allow accommodation to these kinds of issues.

Rise between misfits is always a partial problem. For instance, you can use a P or older F 4X5 front standard on an 8x10 camera, but you're amount of rise will be limited. When you get to the 4X5 F2 front standard, however, the amount of rise is rather ridiculously generous. Nonetheless, even an F 8X10 front standard will be stronger for sake of heavier lenses.

Another minor issue with early Norma is that the ground glass wasn't actually ground, but had a frosted coating, which is dimmer than the later real ground glasses. But this can easily be replaced.

I actually prefer the old Norma tripod mount. It's slower to use, but has a lower center of gravity and is more secure from slippage. But again, a lot depends whether the camera is being used in a studio, or out in the weather under more demanding circumstances.