Any ideas where to look for a replacement Compur for Dollina?

RLangham · May 12, 2020

So I live and do most of my shopping in a very humid climate, and most cameras I find with leaf shutters (beside the ever-present and semi-reliable Argus C3's) have gummed up shutters on which the slow-speed timer no longer runs, making all speeds below, say, 1/50th equal.

At some point, I picked up a Certo Dollina II with Compur-Rapid 500 shutter in a Xenar 5/2.9, with non-functioning slow-speed timer and tight aperture, but a very clean lens and a functioning camera body.

When I was much more naive, I decided to open the front on the shutter and see if I could see the problem myself, with naked untrained eyes. Needless to say I made it worse--it's the inspiration for my forum signature. I don't think a simple CLA will fix this shutter now, and anyways I'm not paying to find out.

How would I go about finding a compatible replacement shutter? I've searched *bay in the past with no luck.

Will any Compur-Rapid 500 (which was only made in #00 size as I recall) have matching threads to my lens elements? And how much do they go for? This is a good Xenar and I'd love to get some use out of this camera.

Failing any of that, has anyone used this weird little camera? It's a pretty normal folding range-finder, but it was so early in the 35mm era. Also the rangefinder was an afterthought, so it's pretty crudely bolted on to what's otherwise a very elegant camera. The cam for the rangefinder is under the focusing knob, and it's actually made of a stamped sheet metal piece with another piece of sheet metal wrapped around and soldered to it, which has a tendency to break, leaving you with a cam that can come apart if you turn the knob too far. It's a pain to fix. Still, it's an amazingly compact little folder and not too heavy. I like it a lot.

jim10219 · May 12, 2020

eBay or forums like this one or the Largeformatphotography page are about your best bets. Try the search functions. I once needed an old Compound 3 shutter and searched eBay for months and one never popped up at a reasonable price. I eventually found one from Kumar (who posts both here and on the LFP page). He had listed it like a year ago and forgot about it. I sent him an email and it took him some time to find out if he still had it, but he did, and I bought it from him, and it was just what I needed! It's kind of one of those things where you just have to be patient and vigilant and keep on checking. One will pop up one day. It just might take a long time.

Usually with these old leaf shutters, they need a CLA unless you're buying from someone who regularly shoots with it and has paid for or done a CLA themselves recently. And you're going to pay a premium for that. If you can't do that work yourself, then you need to factor in that price before making your decision to purchase. Almost no 50+ year old shutter is going to work well without a little work. They didn't use synthetic lubricants back then, so either the lubricants will have gummed up and hardened from lack of use, or they'll be full of dirt and grime from lots of use. It's possible to find one that still works well after all of these years, but not likely.

And even then, there are other problems that can go wrong besides just the shutter. Pinholes in bellows or worn out gears and springs. Most of the old cameras for sale aren't being sold by photographers or people who work on cameras, so it's usually cheaper in the long run if you buy cameras that have been recently serviced, unless you can inspect the camera, and know what you're looking for, before you buy it. You might get lucky from time to time, but the times you'll get burned will really burn a hole in your wallet.

RLangham · May 12, 2020

jim10219 said:
eBay or forums like this one or the Largeformatphotography page are about your best bets. Try the search functions. I once needed an old Compound 3 shutter and searched eBay for months and one never popped up at a reasonable price. I eventually found one from Kumar (who posts both here and on the LFP page). He had listed it like a year ago and forgot about it. I sent him an email and it took him some time to find out if he still had it, but he did, and I bought it from him, and it was just what I needed! It's kind of one of those things where you just have to be patient and vigilant and keep on checking. One will pop up one day. It just might take a long time.

Usually with these old leaf shutters, they need a CLA unless you're buying from someone who regularly shoots with it and has paid for or done a CLA themselves recently. And you're going to pay a premium for that. If you can't do that work yourself, then you need to factor in that price before making your decision to purchase. Almost no 50+ year old shutter is going to work well without a little work. They didn't use synthetic lubricants back then, so either the lubricants will have gummed up and hardened from lack of use, or they'll be full of dirt and grime from lots of use. It's possible to find one that still works well after all of these years, but not likely.

And even then, there are other problems that can go wrong besides just the shutter. Pinholes in bellows or worn out gears and springs. Most of the old cameras for sale aren't being sold by photographers or people who work on cameras, so it's usually cheaper in the long run if you buy cameras that have been recently serviced, unless you can inspect the camera, and know what you're looking for, before you buy it. You might get lucky from time to time, but the times you'll get burned will really burn a hole in your wallet.

I think I should clarify. When I say I don't want to pay for a CLA, I mean on a shutter that I know for a fact I've already damaged myself. I'm fine paying for a CLA on an ostensibly undamaged shutter that has a probability of working.

I will say I have been lucky enough to find working leaf shutters of the same age and complexity that were probably CLA'd a few decades ago, when technicians were more plentiful. My Recomar has a Compur that runs perfectly at every speed and is just a little sluggish on the self-timer.

Also, I already have the Dollina and despite some cosmetic damage, it's actually in fantastic shape for its age. Surprisingly the bellows is in great shape. I payed like 20 USD for it.

Also a correction. I have the Radionar lens. I don't know why I said Xenar.

shutterfinger · May 12, 2020

Can you post some pictures of the shutter you "damaged" as it is now? I might have a working Compur 00 that will fit your camera.

RLangham · May 12, 2020

shutterfinger said:
Can you post some pictures of the shutter you "damaged" as it is now? I might have a working Compur 00 that will fit your camera.

The damage is internal and I'm not near screwdrivers small enough to open it.

I'd snap a picture of the exterior with my phone but my phone makes image files that are too large and have to be resized in a photo program, and I only have one on my computer. I'll have to post pictures in a few hours. Sorry!

I don't know what I did, I just know that it definitely made things worse just by opening it and touching some of the components. For instance, the high speed spring for 1/500th feels weaker when I turn the dial to 1/500, and there's no longer extra resistance when I cock the shutter at that speed. T acts like B and B sticks open until I forcefully mess with the shutter release.

But let's talk about your shutter. How much do you want for it? It is just the shutter, right?

shutterfinger · May 12, 2020

https://learncamerarepair.com/productlist.php?category=2&secondary=20
The Compur 00 is a workhorse shutter. https://learncamerarepair.com/product.php?product=7&category=2&secondary=20 the CN-1110-000 was used in many cameras with each brand having its own variation. Most differences are minor with other more major. The brands will not interchange without modification. Your camera/lens combo is not listed in the Compur repair manual. There is little difference internally between a Compur Rapid and Synchro Compur.
I can likely fix your shutter.

RLangham · May 12, 2020

shutterfinger said:
https://learncamerarepair.com/productlist.php?category=2&secondary=20
The Compur 00 is a workhorse shutter. https://learncamerarepair.com/product.php?product=7&category=2&secondary=20 the CN-1110-000 was used in many cameras with each brand having its own variation. Most differences are minor with other more major. The brands will not interchange without modification. Your camera/lens combo is not listed in the Compur repair manual. There is little difference internally between a Compur Rapid and Synchro Compur.
I can likely fix your shutter.

I appreciate the offer but since my last post the rangefinder cam just popped out of joint again, and I'm tired of fixing it. I'm not going to want to mess with this camera for a while. Thanks, though! Maybe down the road.

shutterfinger · May 12, 2020

A Rim Set Compur will be significantly different internally but can be repaired with the linked manuals. Compur Rapid 300 to Compur Rapid 500 very similar, Compur Rapid to Synchro Compur very similar.
The Compur Rapid was used in Rolleiflex, Rolleicord, and Kodak cameras. The Rollei use different face plates, cocking, release, and aperture levers. Kodak models have internal differences. Body release versions, cocked with film advance, and front focus lens types are camera specific. The working and non working 00's I have are from large format lens and cameras that use the base shutter without alterations.

shutterfinger · May 13, 2020

Read what http://camera-wiki.org/wiki/Dollina has to say about the Dollina II rangefinder. The camera uses a standard Compur Rapid shutter with a top speed of 1/500. A Compur Rapid with a top speed of 1/300 or a Synchro Compur can be used on the body.
The shutter I have is a Compur with B, 1 to 1/500 and no PC socket. It is not working below 1/25 except for B. I'll service it before selling it.

RLangham · May 13, 2020

shutterfinger said:
Read what http://camera-wiki.org/wiki/Dollina has to say about the Dollina II rangefinder. The camera uses a standard Compur Rapid shutter with a top speed of 1/500. A Compur Rapid with a top speed of 1/300 or a Synchro Compur can be used on the body.
The shutter I have is a Compur with B, 1 to 1/500 and no PC socket. It is not working below 1/25 except for B. I'll service it before selling it.

I wrote half that page under a different name, while I was sitting in a very boring English class! Normally I was on our Hattiesburg campus while the teacher taught via video link, but I'd actually gone down to the coast that day, hung out with my dad, bought this camera in Bay St. Louis, and gone and attended class on our Long Beach campus, with a few students and the teacher in the room and the rest of the class in Hattiesburg on a big screen. The class was so dry and pointless that I just pulled up that page, found it sparse, and began to rewrite it while the teacher thought I was taking notes.

Actually, I had a big debate with another student about Creole Hypothesis of Middle English while I was writing it... better days!

Anyways, I'm thinking about trying to have a cam 3d printed. I could totally make a CAD file of the cam, and there are services that will print and mail cheaply, so it wouldn't be a massive investment of time or money. How much for the serviced shutter?

bernard_L · May 13, 2020

shutterfinger said:
https://learncamerarepair.com/productlist.php?category=2&secondary=20

Thank you for that link !!
For years I have been collecting service manuals one by one (even buying a couple of them), and that site seems to have everything as pdf free downloads.

shutterfinger · May 13, 2020

If you bent shutter blades, aperture blades, or broke a pin off the main plate then your shutter is not repairable otherwise it is. The booster spring if positioned out of place on reassembly will not be engaged when turning to 1/500.

It will be a few days to a week before I get this one working, I'll price it then. I'm a stinker about keeping vintage cameras factory original if possible.

RLangham · May 13, 2020

shutterfinger said:
If you bent shutter blades, aperture blades, or broke a pin off the main plate then your shutter is not repairable otherwise it is. The booster spring if positioned out of place on reassembly will not be engaged when turning to 1/500.

It will be a few days to a week before I get this one working, I'll price it then. I'm a stinker about keeping vintage cameras factory original if possible.

Well, do respond to this thread or DM me then, huh? I'd appreciate it.

dynachrome · May 13, 2020

You can either call Ken Ruth out of retirement or maybe call SK Grimes.

Any ideas where to look for a replacement Compur for Dollina?

Privacy & Transparency

Privacy & Transparency