Any 4x4 cameras that take 120 film?

gone · Mar 24, 2022

My 35mm enlarger appears to be able to handle 4x4, but not 6x6. Rather than upgrade the enlarger and buy a 6x6 camera, I thought I'd buy a 4x4 camera. The Agfa 4x4's look doable, kinda like toy cameras, but that's OK.

Are there any other 4x4 shooters that will take a 120 film spool? I guess a folder would be out of the question, the cute little baby Ikontas were 127 and that's a dead end road. Something w/ better features than the Agfa cameras would be nice, but anything at this point would work.

Donald Qualls · Mar 24, 2022

The original Diana shot 4x4 on 120, and it would be easy to modify the 6x4.5 mask for a Holga. Not sure you'd ever want to project anything from one of those, though.

You could easily mask a 6x4.5 folder to make 4x4 images. Or you could invest in a film slitting setup and make all the 16-exposure (on 4x4) 127 rolls you like for a Baby Rolleiflex, Yashica 44, or Sawyer's Mk. IV. Any emulsion you can buy in 120, and at 120 price (rather than double for 127). Recutting works in the full frame and half frame (8 exposure and 16 exposure) 127 folders, too, but you have to mask a couple millimeters of the frame so your frames don't overlap.

A Bencini Koroll 24S shoots 24 3x4 images on 120. Not a great lens, but coated glass, and very limited adjustments, but better than a Holga or Diana.

Focomatter · Mar 24, 2022

Backs (aka film magazines) that do this for the Hasselblad were the models 16S and A16S.

Paul Howell · Mar 24, 2022

If your going to buy a Agfa 4X4 might as well buy a 6X6, I would get a cheap TLR, Yasicha A, C, or D, use a grease pencil to outline 4X4, once the negatives are developed and dry, cut the edges down to 4X4. Does you enlarger have a 4X4 negative carrier?

mshchem · Mar 24, 2022

127 film?

Rick A · Mar 24, 2022

If I were to look for a 4x4 camera, I would hunt down a Sawyers Mk IV or a Topcon Primo Jr( they are the same camera and Rollei knock offs for better value) or a Yashica 44 (I had one years back), even a Baby Rolleiflex. None take 120 film, all are 127. The Sawyers is one of the better made TLR's out there.

GRHazelton · Mar 24, 2022

Sadly 127 film is expensive and only a few emulsions are available. I have a Komaflex S, which is a 127 SLR leaf shutter machine. If there were a good selection of 127 film out there I would look into a CLA for it, but now....

Dan Daniel · Mar 24, 2022

The adapter kit for 16 frames on 120 film for Rolleicord Va and Vb has a viewfinder mask for 4x4. And the internal film mask has notches for the 4x4 location in the 4.5 x 6 exposure. I assume that the 16 frame kit for a Rolleiflex T has a similar setup option.

So this fits your criteria- takes 4x4 images on 120 film. Then again, keep your eyes on the local craigs list for a beseler 23c enlarger and open up the full range of medium format.

mshchem · Mar 24, 2022

Focomatter said:
Backs (aka film magazines) that do this for the Hasselblad were the models 16S and A16S.

Which Hasselblad back was the one that made a 645 image, vertical, only 12 exposures to a roll? Portrait orientation without needing to rotate camera. I these are quite scarce.

ic-racer · Mar 24, 2022

Not sure I follow, so your enlarger accepts 120 film but will only project 4x4cm image? Or is the plan to cut the 120 down to 127 after processing; certainly much easier than doing it before exposure.

BrianShaw · Mar 24, 2022

mshchem said:
Which Hasselblad back was the one that made a 645 image, vertical, only 12 exposures to a roll? Portrait orientation without needing to rotate camera. I these are quite scarce.

A12V

JNP · Mar 24, 2022

comet

gone · Mar 24, 2022

The Bencini Comet! How could I have forgotten that one. There's only 1 model that's 4x4 I think, the others may be 3x4, which might be fun to shoot too. There was the US made Zenith Comet too, but I don't know if it takes 120 film like the Bencini Comets.

My enlarger has a maximum image circle on the baseboard of a little over 4x4, w/ no light fall off at any of the print sizes I do, so it's good to go for 4x4. Most 35mm enlargers can probably do 4x4.

The idea of a folder w/ a mask sounds great, and w/ just the sweet spot of the lens being used, even the 3 element lenses should give sharp photos. Thanks Donald. I like the Ikontas, and the Nettars have low prices, but a 6x4.5 camera would be small compared to the 6x6.

richyd · Mar 25, 2022

I have a folding Franka Solida II that has 4x4 masking built in. It also comes with a superb performing, sharp Xenar lens, great results.

Donald Qualls · Mar 25, 2022

GRHazelton said:
Sadly 127 film is expensive and only a few emulsions are available.

Happily, it's easy to recut 120 to 127 -- longer roll, full selection of emulsions, and barely more work then respooling to 620.

momus said:
The Bencini Comet! How could I have forgotten that one.

All the Bencini Comet versions I'm aware of (I, II, and very different looking III) were 127 half frame (3x4) -- which requires masking a couple millimeters of the frame to avoid overlaps if you use recut 120 with the original 6x6 framing track.

Paul Howell · Mar 25, 2022

momus said:
The Bencini Comet! How could I have forgotten that one. There's only 1 model that's 4x4 I think, the others may be 3x4, which might be fun to shoot too. There was the US made Zenith Comet too, but I don't know if it takes 120 film like the Bencini Comets.

What are your plans for a negative carrier?
My enlarger has a maximum image circle on the baseboard of a little over 4x4, w/ no light fall off at any of the print sizes I do, so it's good to go for 4x4. Most 35mm enlargers can probably do 4x4.

The idea of a folder w/ a mask sounds great, and w/ just the sweet spot of the lens being used, even the 3 element lenses should give sharp photos. Thanks Donald. I like the Ikontas, and the Nettars have low prices, but a 6x4.5 camera would be small compared to the 6x6.

outwest · Mar 25, 2022

Mamiya made a nifty cutter like a paper punch that cut 4x4 sections out of 6x4.5 film. Some of the Mamiya 6x4.5 cameras are excellent performers and inexpensive. The Hasselblad backs, at least the ones I have seen, merely mask off a smaller area on 6x6 film and don't give you any more images per roll.

Any 4x4 cameras that take 120 film?

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