agitation: every 30 or 60 seconds

ymc226 · Oct 6, 2009

It seems that on most threads/responses to agitation, it's at most, every 60 seconds.

Since I began in the darkroom, I've followed Kodak's D76, Xtol, HC110 data sheets and they recommend 5 seconds every 30 seconds up to 5 inversions each time. My contrast is all over given different scenes I shoot but I do admit, my beach scenes are pretty high contrast.

Is anyone else out there agitating every 30 seconds or does it increase the contrast too much?

bobwysiwyg · Oct 6, 2009

I agitate 30 seconds to start, and every thirty seconds I do 5 inversions over the prescribed time depending on the chem temps. Works for me. I also use D76. I don't know if it matters in this case, but I'm a long-time member of the pre-soak camp.

Bob-D659 · Oct 6, 2009

Whatever you do, be consistent, and following the makers directions until you really know what you are doing is not a bad idea, it worked for me 45 years ago, and it still does. Of course, P.E.'s advice usually overules the package directions.

Under agitating will cause you way more grief than following the package directions.

Jeff Kubach · Oct 6, 2009

I usually do 30 second agitation. I do 5-8 inversions. I also pre-soak also. Works for me!

Jeff

Rhodes · Oct 6, 2009

I do 30s agitation when I'm developing kodak films (as they recomend, possibly due to their emulations. I also fix longer with their films). When using ilford films, I tend to do 60s invertions!

RalphLambrecht · Oct 6, 2009

Bob-D659 said:
Whatever you do, be consistent...

Amen to that!

I prefer the constant agitation of rotary processing, which shows that, as long as you are consistent, you cannot agitate too much (unless you mistake the developing tank for a cocktail shaker).

Sirius Glass · Oct 6, 2009

Five inversions every 30 seconds with XTOL full strength.

Steve

thebdt · Oct 6, 2009

I have always done it three inversions, and then a good "thump" to dislodge air bubbles. I don't know if this is the "proper" way, but I have been consistent with it and thusly know what to expect...

Edit: three inversions every thirty seconds

Edit: yes, it did say three every three... yes that was a typo

2F/2F · Oct 6, 2009

Both Ilford and Kodak say to agitate 10 seconds out of every minute. Where they say to do the agitation is different. Kodak sez 25 seconds standing, 5 seconds agitation. Ilford sez 50 seconds standing, 10 seconds agitating. Either one works. I find the Ilford method to make consistency easier. Just doing the same thing every time is really the important thing.

bsdunek · Oct 6, 2009

I just do two inversions in five seconds every thirty seconds. A little less than some of you. I rotate the tank when I set it down so the inversions are in a different direction each time. Nothing scientific, just seems like a good way to do it. It has worked for me for nearly 60 years, and for my Dad for 30 years before that.

L Gebhardt · Oct 6, 2009

If the time is short, say around 5 minutes, I agitate 5 seconds every 30. For a 10 minute time I go with 10 seconds every 60. The most important thing is to be consistent, so take good notes for each roll as you are working out a new time.

fschifano · Oct 6, 2009

I do it the Kodak way. Thirty seconds initial agitation, followed by 5 seconds each half minute thereafter. Works perfectly for me. I used to use Ilford's recommendation of 10 seconds each minute. That worked ok too. Whatever you do, be consistent. It's one less variable to consider as you dial in development times to suit your needs.

BetterSense · Oct 6, 2009

I guess I don't agitate as much. I do three inversions every minute, maybe four if I'm feeling froggy. Works for me. Doing it every 30 seconds seems like you might as well never set the tank down.

goldenimage · Oct 6, 2009

i invert probably 4 times every 30 sec, the first 30 sec of the time i agitate continuously, this method has always worked well for me, even with sheet film in trays, i use d76 also

Ken Nadvornick · Oct 6, 2009

BetterSense said:
I guess I don't agitate as much. I do three inversions every minute, maybe four if I'm feeling froggy. Works for me. Doing it every 30 seconds seems like you might as well never set the tank down.

I do even less. Exactly two inversions every 60 seconds, after an initial 30 seconds constant agitation. Tank and solutions all sit in the same tempered water bath at precisely 68F. Times are understandably a bit longer. In the 13-18 minute range using D-76d 1+1, depending on specific film. But that only helps smooth out any wandering variables.

Since this is the setup I calibrated my negatives with, I must use it as is until I die. Lord help me if I ever break my trusty Paterson 500ml plastic graduate...

Ken

Tony-S · Oct 7, 2009

Knock a couple of times at the beginning, the 10" agitation. After that, stand 50", agitate 10".

Brandon D. · Oct 7, 2009

Has anyone even ever figured out if it even matters if it's done every 30 seconds or every 60 seconds? If anything, you could do a trail-and-error test to figure out which one you like best...

markbarendt · Oct 7, 2009

The biggest thing I've found here is that I'm more consistent at 30 seconds, not enough time to run off.

Brandon D. said:
Has anyone even ever figured out if it even matters if it's done every 30 seconds or every 60 seconds? If anything, you could do a trail-and-error test to figure out which one you like best...

f1.4 · Oct 7, 2009

The textbook wisdom is that the less agitation the higher the edge sharpness in the negative.
So I do 3 tank revolutions over 10 seconds every 60 seconds.
This after an initial continuous slow inversion period of 30 seconds. (Again at the speed of 3 revolutions per 10 seconds.)
Since the overall amount of agitation influences the development of the highlights and the contrast curve, consistency from film to film is probably the most important.

BobNewYork · Oct 7, 2009

Brandon D. said:
Has anyone even ever figured out if it even matters if it's done every 30 seconds or every 60 seconds? If anything, you could do a trail-and-error test to figure out which one you like best...

I'm pretty sure it doesn't matter - it's probable that you'll get somewhat, (probably slightly) different results. The real point is to do it exactly the same way every time. I've standardized on constant agitation for the first minute and four inversions every minute thereafter. I do the inversions in different directions. I use this same procedure for every film / developer combination - the only thing that changes is the development time. Personally, I think that consistency is the most important thing you'll ever do - otherwise you're shooting at a moving target every time.

Bob H

funkpilz · Oct 7, 2009

I only use Ilford and Agfa emulsions, and I agitate for 10 seconds, let it sit for 50, agitate for 10, let it sit for 50, and so on.

RalphLambrecht · Oct 7, 2009

f/1 said:
The textbook wisdom is that the less agitation the higher the edge sharpness in the negative.
So I do 3 tank revolutions over 10 seconds every 60 seconds.
This after an initial continuous slow inversion period of 30 seconds. (Again at the speed of 3 revolutions per 10 seconds.)
Since the overall amount of agitation influences the development of the highlights and the contrast curve, consistency from film to film is probably the most important.

I doubt that 'very 30' or 'every 60' makes any difference in sharpness. To achieve the highest levels of acutance, you need to get closer to stand development or use special emulsion/developer combinations. Also, constant agitation, as in rotation development, doesn't mean you lose all negative sharpness. I believe all the agitation schemes, mentioned so far, are pretty much interchangeable, except for rotation.

Stregone · Oct 8, 2009

What are the different effects of rotation?

RalphLambrecht · Oct 8, 2009

Stregone said:
What are the different effects of rotation?

If executed by the Jobo processors, only a slight reduction in development time. I like them for ease of use and consistency of development.

pcyco · Oct 8, 2009

hallo

my way with d23 or d76

agiate the first 30 seconds and then every minute 5 inversions

works well

thomas

a good explenation is in the filmdev. book it depends on how fast you can pour the chem. into the tank

agitation: every 30 or 60 seconds

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