Advice on planning for a trip.

Katier · Dec 29, 2008

Hi Guys ( and gals )

I'm planning a trip to Holland in September. Some time off I know but I'm planning out what kit to take with me.

Currently I use 35mm but I'm planning on getting some Medium Format kit both for next semester at University and this project. I was thinking of getting a TLR for urban work (architecture and street) in 6x6 as the square format appeals so advice on that front would be appreciated.

However for the trip to Holland I am planning on doing work and visiting the sites of Operation Market Garden. It occured to me it would be interesting to take some of the photos on a period camera. Especially one likely to have been carried by paratroopers and XXX corps soldiers. Therefore I was considering something like a VPK ( I know they were used in WWI - guessing as the model b was produced till just before the war good chance they were used then too ) or something similar.

I know using a VPK requires 127 film which I believe can still be aquired.

Question is is this a good idea or should I stick to MF or 35mm?

Thoughts?

jolefler · Dec 29, 2008

Just a thought....35mm and 120 gear were also carried by the troops, so a camera from that era doesn't need to be limited by obscure film sourcing.

Jo

Mike Richards · Dec 29, 2008

In the Market Garden region, you will not find original scenes, infrastructure, or artifacts except in the museums. These plus monuments and cemeteries are about all that remains to photograph. World War II was a war of mobility, so little was disturbed and less was left intact. The possible exceptions are the Normandy fortifications and famous beaches. So, I'd not be concerned about trying to capture the original "look" of the war with period equipment. Your 35mm gear should be fine.

If you want to get into original scenery, you need to go back to WWI, which was a war of stagnation, fixed fortifications, trenches and massive artillery barrages. In Verdun, France, for example, there are many bombed out structures, gun emplacements, miles of original trenches, and acres of pock marked terrain. One can create an original "look" more easily there, although I don't think original equipment is as important as film selection.

MikeSeb · Dec 29, 2008

A Speed Graphic would certainly have been found among the gear carried by photographers of that era.

Katier · Dec 29, 2008

Mike Richards said:
In the Market Garden region, you will not find original scenes, infrastructure, or artifacts except in the museums. These plus monuments and cemeteries are about all that remains to photograph. World War II was a war of mobility, so little was disturbed and less was left intact. The possible exceptions are the Normandy fortifications and famous beaches. So, I'd not be concerned about trying to capture the original "look" of the war with period equipment. Your 35mm gear should be fine.

If you want to get into original scenery, you need to go back to WWI, which was a war of stagnation, fixed fortifications, trenches and massive artillery barrages. In Verdun, France, for example, there are many bombed out structures, gun emplacements, miles of original trenches, and acres of pock marked terrain. One can create an original "look" more easily there, although I don't think original equipment is as important as film selection.

Oh I know, and this was especially true of Market Garden. However there are origonal buildings still in existance and September 2009 is the 65th anniversary so I fully expect there to be period equipment and aircraft around.

Much of the origonal buildings I do exist though I believe including the Hotel ( now the museum which is currently closed, hopefully it'll re-open by september - be silly if it fails in that).

The main reason for considering period equipment was that it would be an interesting exersize to use the same equipment. It's quite likely the work would go towards my degree so it's also another facet for that.

Q.G. · Dec 29, 2008

you will not find original scenes, infrastructure, or artifacts

Well, the bridges are still there. And if not all original, the places they are in are still there too. So are the rivers and canals they cross. And the sites of the droppings. The route along which relieve should have come too.

But Holland is the wrong place to go to.
It all happened in North-Brabant and Gelderland. Not in Holland.

Katier · Dec 29, 2008

*chuckles* I guess your dutch Q.C.?

I appreciate the correction, I did of course mean 'Netherlands'

And yes as I understood it much of the buildings, routes and bridges are intact.

Q.G. · Dec 29, 2008

Yep. Dutch. "Netherlandish"

Katier · Dec 29, 2008

Anyway back to the origonal question.

I'm hoping to have a TLR by then that I want to use in other project before hand ( hoping to get a Mamiya C2xx or C3xx as they seem the best choice ).

The idea of using a camera on this trip that was from the era is one I'd like to explore although I don't know if the VPK is a sensible choice. Speed graphic is likely to be too pricey. So thoughts on that. Obviously 35mm isn't a bad format and is nice and mobile but if I have a period MF camera would doing the whole thing on MF be more sensible or just forget the period camera idea and stick to modern 35mm?

Q.G. · Dec 29, 2008

I'd say it's a question that only you can answer.
As far as taking pictures is concerned, it doesn't really matter much what you use, does it?
So what are your reasons for thinking about doing it using a period camera?

jamesgignac · Dec 29, 2008

I have a Mamiya c330, but I would hardly call mine a 'period camera', unless your period is the 1980's. It sounds like you're wanting to shoot with it simply for 'nostalgia feel' - are you actually interested in the moderate bump-up to 6x6 negatives or is this less of a concern? I agree a Speed Graphic (or a Crown if you want it to be moderately more portable and don't care about the focal plane shutter) would be a cool idea...and would be a bit more authentic than the Mamiya if that's your reasoning for using it - but developing & printing 4x5 means a whole other buy-in if you're not currently set up to use one.

So, as Q.G. asked, what's the reasoning? The Mamiya TLRs are a lot of fun, BTW...so if you're just looking to have a good time - give the Mamiya a call.

Katier · Dec 29, 2008

I guess it's just a fascination with the past and it's a chance to get ones hands on and use something historic in a setting that has meaning.

Katier · Dec 29, 2008

As for bigger negatives, yes I think they might be usefull. Not to mention square negs gives the option of cropping to portrait/lanscape if required although sticking to square sounds interesting. I might also need the extra quality.

Q.G. · Dec 30, 2008

Then perhaps a Rolleiflex TLR?
Square. You can find ones from the period.
And though from 'the other side', quite probably used on both sides (just like Contax and Leica).

Advice on planning for a trip.

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