Adox Rodinal vrs RO-9 One Shot

studiocarter · Feb 21, 2023

Adox Rodinal was used in 2022 to develop 7222 negatives up to 3200 ISO by the stand method. After two to three hours discarded developer had turned black.
RO-9 One Shot never changed like that.
Why?
I would still be using Adox but can not buy it any more. It either is not shipped or is Not in Stock or Backordered.
Will test results match?

aparat · Feb 21, 2023

studiocarter said:
Adox Rodinal was used in 2022 to develop 7222 negatives up to 3200 ISO by the stand method. After two to three hours discarded developer had turned black.
RO-9 One Shot never changed like that.
Why?
I would still be using Adox but can not buy it any more. It either is not shipped or is Not in Stock or Backordered.
Will test results match?

I do not know why what you described happened, but I did run a test between the two developers using a 40 minute stand development, and they produced virtually identical results, at least with Fomapan 100. I have not tested the 7222 negatives you use, so I cannot predict if the same result would hold.

adox_rodinal_rollei_R09 by Nick Mazur, on Flickr

studiocarter · Feb 21, 2023

aparat said:
I do not know why what you described happened, but I did run a test between the two developers using a 40 minute stand development, and they produced virtually identical results, at least with Fomapan 100. I have not tested the 7222 negatives you use, so I cannot predict if the same result would hold.

adox_rodinal_rollei_R09 by Nick Mazur, on Flickr

Thanks. If you are not looking for the darkening of used developer it is easy to miss when dumping it out.

relistan · Feb 21, 2023

It is turning dark from oxidation. If one developer is oxidizing faster than the other, that can be from either having less sulfite in the formula to begin with, or from being partially oxidized already in the bottle and therefore having less sulfite. Oxidizing in open air after you've used it should be no big deal.

ADOX Fotoimpex · Feb 21, 2023

studiocarter said:
Adox Rodinal was used in 2022 to develop 7222 negatives up to 3200 ISO by the stand method. After two to three hours discarded developer had turned black.
RO-9 One Shot never changed like that.
Why?
I would still be using Adox but can not buy it any more. It either is not shipped or is Not in Stock or Backordered.
Will test results match?

The current unavailability has to do with exactly this difference. We use highly purified medical grade Paraminophenole and some other new substances for Rodinal to kleep it clear and there is a world wide shortage of this. This is why we could not produce as much as we wanted in 2022 and since shipping to the US still takes unusually long Rodinal suffers from a temporary unavailability. The problems are partially resolved though and we just sent a large shippment to the US.

pentaxuser · Feb 21, 2023

ADOX Fotoimpex said:
The current unavailability has to do with exactly this difference. We use highly purified medical grade Paraminophenole and some other new substances for Rodinal to kleep it clear and there is a world wide shortage of this.

Just out of interest, what has caused this world-wide shortage to arise and is there reason to believe that the shortage will soon be ended?

Thanks

pentaxuser

ADOX Fotoimpex · Feb 21, 2023

pentaxuser said:
Just out of interest, what has caused this world-wide shortage to arise and is there reason to believe that the shortage will soon be ended?

Thanks

pentaxuser

Paraminophenol is basically Paracetamol. We recently had a shortage here in Europe. This was especially a problem with childrens fever reducing medicine. We might look at governmental market regulation here but we do not know. All we know is that our orders were canceled (and the price was qudrippled over one year). We then needed to find a comparably pure product which was not classified for medical use and would not sacrifice our quality.
How much all of this narrows down to only one or two manufacturers in India or China is at this point somewhat beyond my scope.
We found some and have enough for this year and will explore in the meantime if needed ;-)

aparat · Feb 21, 2023

For those of you interested in fresh Adox Rodinal and Rollei R09 One Shot performance, here are a few tests I ran recently, some using rotary and some using stand agitation. As you can see, Rodinal produces very unique tonality, which it is known and loved for. It's not for everybody, though, as all things photography. If you'd like to see high-resolution scans, let me know, and I will upload them:

delta100_Rodinal100 by Nick Mazur, on Flickr

delta100_Rodinal25 by Nick Mazur, on Flickr

delta100_AdoxRodinal100 by Nick Mazur, on Flickr

400TX_Rodinal25 by Nick Mazur, on Flickr

pentaxuser · Feb 22, 2023

ADOX Fotoimpex said:
Paraminophenol is basically Paracetamol. We recently had a shortage here in Europe. This was especially a problem with childrens fever reducing medicine. We might look at governmental market regulation here but we do not know. All we know is that our orders were canceled (and the price was qudrippled over one year). We then needed to find a comparably pure product which was not classified for medical use and would not sacrifice our quality.
How much all of this narrows down to only one or two manufacturers in India or China is at this point somewhat beyond my scope.
We found some and have enough for this year and will explore in the meantime if needed ;-)

Thanks for the reply It just seems that the "world" post the Covid pandemic lockdown seems to have a lot of unexplained shortages and the explanations do not always seem to be easy to find nor does there seem to be much information about when such shortages might be solved

pentaxuser

Alan Johnson · Feb 22, 2023

aparat said:
For those of you interested in fresh Adox Rodinal and Rollei R09 One Shot performance, here are a few tests I ran recently, some using rotary and some using stand agitation. As you can see, Rodinal produces very unique tonality, which it is known and loved for. It's not for everybody, though, as all things photography. If you'd like to see high-resolution scans, let me know, and I will upload them:

delta100_Rodinal100 by Nick Mazur, on Flickr

delta100_Rodinal25 by Nick Mazur, on Flickr

delta100_AdoxRodinal100 by Nick Mazur, on Flickr

400TX_Rodinal25 by Nick Mazur, on Flickr

Thanks for posting these.
Do you have any results that either confirm or deny that at a given contrast Rodinal loses film speed compared to D-76?

aparat · Feb 22, 2023

Alan Johnson said:
Thanks for posting these.
Do you have any results that either confirm or deny that at a given contrast Rodinal loses film speed compared to D-76?

I have found a very slight loss of film speed with Rodinal 1+25, but you get some of that speed back with longer semi-stand or stand processing and 1+100 dilution. I have compared Delta 100 and 400TX side-by-side in Rodinal 1+25. Typically, in my tests, 400TX is about ISO 200 and Delta 100 ISO 100. So, as you can see, only a very slight loss of speed. Personally, I would not worry about it, if I liked the look of a film in Rodinal. It's an easy trade-off to live with, I think.

delta100_Rodinal25 by Nick Mazur, on Flickr

400TX_Rodinal25 by Nick Mazur, on Flickr

Pioneer · Feb 22, 2023

I went back to mixing my own when Adox was having trouble getting supplies to the US. If it is back in stock I'll buy it again.

aparat · Feb 22, 2023

Pioneer said:
I went back to mixing my own when Adox was having trouble getting supplies to the US. If it is back in stock I'll buy it again.

Would you mind sharing your formula for Rodinal? I think it would be interesting to compare home-brew with commercially available Rodinal (or R09). Thanks!

studiocarter · Mar 3, 2023

A Google search on, make Rodinal, provided a recipe for me. 30 Tylenol 500s, sodium sulfate and sodium hydroxide then let sit 72 hours. I am still sitting.

John Wiegerink · Mar 3, 2023

studiocarter said:
A Google search on, make Rodinal, provided a recipe for me. 30 Tylenol 500s, sodium sulfate and sodium hydroxide then let sit 72 hours. I am still sitting.

I think you made a typo? Should be sodium sulfite and not sodium sulfate.

relistan · Mar 3, 2023

aparat said:
Would you mind sharing your formula for Rodinal? I think it would be interesting to compare home-brew with commercially available Rodinal (or R09). Thanks!

Here’s a link to @Donald Qualls old website where he had done a lot of the refining work on parodinal years ago. It has his various recipes.

Developer formulae, dilutions, and times

Film developing information

web.archive.org

Donald Qualls · Mar 5, 2023

I never did that comparison, because once I had working Parodinal, I never bothered to buy the commercial variety. I was getting what I wanted (versatility -- dilutions of 1:25 and 1:100 have significantly different character -- and simplicity of use along with long enough shelf life for my needs), so never saw the need to get the original to test against. For my own use, I've mainly used 1:50 with extended time and agitation only every third minute to offset the well-known loss of speed at normal contrast. An extra ten minutes or so of developing time is no big deal, compared to getting the combination of sharpness and speed usually not attributed to simple single-agent developers (and the economy of the homemade developer).

redbandit · Mar 9, 2023

the differences between the two from what the internet claims... merely what one expects with different lot dates of a chemical product. Or developing in summer at high noon with the windows open, compared to developing at high noon in december during a snow storm

foc · Mar 9, 2023

redbandit said:
the differences between the two from what the internet claims... merely what one expects with different lot dates of a chemical product. Or developing in summer at high noon with the windows open, compared to developing at high noon in december during a snow storm

What about developing under the light of a full moon, agitating in an anti-clockwise swirl while making incantations?

madNbad · Mar 9, 2023

foc said:
What about developing under the light of a full moon, agitating in an anti-clockwise swirl while making incantations?

Don’t forget the marimba music!

Alan Johnson · Mar 9, 2023

There did used to be a different formula version called Adox APH-09 but it was discontinued.
I remember that because I bought some, not opened yet.
IIRC it was a low pH version based on the pre don't mention the war formula.
IDK if Foma still make that formula.

foc · Mar 9, 2023

madNbad said:
Don’t forget the marimba music!

madNbad · Mar 9, 2023

Alan Johnson said:
There did used to be a different formula version called Adox APH-09 but it was discontinued.
I remember that because I bought some, not opened yet.
IIRC it was a low pH version based on the pre don't mention the war formula.
IDK if Foma still make that formula.

Foma calls it R09 but it may differ from the Compard Rollei R09. I have used the Rollei version, working on a couple of bottles of the Adox version, so I'm in no hurry to try it quite yet.

Pioneer · Mar 13, 2023

aparat said:
Would you mind sharing your formula for Rodinal? I think it would be interesting to compare home-brew with commercially available Rodinal (or R09). Thanks!

Sorry I missed this. I use the formula posted by Donald Qualls. 30 Tylenol, 50 gr sodium sulfite, 20 gr sodium hydroxide. I let it stand for a couple of days and then filter it through a coffee filter to get some of the tylenol tablet filler material out of the mix. It begins to darken as it ages but that does not seem to effect how it works, bad or good. It works quite well for me and I use it at 1:25 and 1:50 at the times recommended on the Massive Development chart for Rodinal. I do make sure to shake it well before i mix it for use because there are crystals that form in the stock developer solution.

I will be picking up a bottle of Adox Rodinal but more as a backup if I have no time to mix my own batch. So far that has not been an issue. I only mix 250ml at a time so it does get used up pretty quick. I can't say if this formula has the same lasting qualities that Adox's Rodinal has. So far it hasn't gone bad on me though a batch or two have gotten pretty dark.

aparat · Mar 13, 2023

@Pioneer Thanks! I'll give it a try.

Adox Rodinal vrs RO-9 One Shot

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