Adox Pan-x Reverso Super8 (Silvermax) processed with Scala process?

mr.datsun · Aug 23, 2015

Thinking about having a cart of Adox Pan-x Reverso Super8 (which is Silvermax) reversal processed through the Scala process.

Questions.

Where can this still be done in Euroland? (I know about dr5 in USA)
What differences might I expect to see against having it done in some standard reversal b&w process?

Thanks.

Simon

miha · Aug 23, 2015

These two are recommended:

http://www.schwarzweissdia.de/

http://www.photostudio13.de/

mr.datsun · Aug 23, 2015

miha said:
These two are recommended:

http://www.schwarzweissdia.de/

http://www.photostudio13.de/

Thanks. Not sure those do cinefilm.... but I can write and ask.

EDIT. I see that the first is the one used by Henning Serger. It would be nice if they did cinefilm, too.

Henning Serger · Aug 24, 2015

mr.datsun said:
Where can this still be done in Euroland?

Hi,

two labs are recommended for that:

1. http://www.andecfilm.de/
2. http://www.super8.nl/english/e_index.htm

Best regards,
Henning

Ricardo Miranda · Aug 24, 2015

Hi

If your intention is to have this Super8 film developed as positive for projection, you can send it to the Widescreen Centre in London.
They still process Super8 and Standard 8.

mr.datsun · Aug 24, 2015

Ricardo,
I have had films developed at super8.nl already. I know I can do that. And personally I do not use the widescreen centre as they act as brokers and I'd rather send it direct.

My real question is about the Scala process. Does anyone provide the Scala process for super 8? Sorry if my original post is not clear.

Henning Serger · Aug 25, 2015

mr.datsun said:
My real question is about the Scala process. Does anyone provide the Scala process for super 8? Sorry if my original post is not clear.

Well, the problem is not the Scala reversal process. The problem is the developing machine:
Photo Studio 13 for example is using a modified Refrema dip and dunk machine for their Scala process for photo films. In this machine you can normaly develop films with a maximum length of 5 meters.
But your S8 PanX Reverso film has 15 meters length.
Therefore Photo Studio 13 would have to build a complete new frame for 15 meters film length. That do cost. And it only makes sense if there is enough demand.
If you could guarantee that you send them at least 20 films p.a., then they could do it building such a special frame.

Best regards,
Henning

mr.datsun · Aug 26, 2015

Henning Serger said:
Well, the problem is not the Scala reversal process. The problem is the developing machine:
Photo Studio 13 for example is using a modified Refrema dip and dunk machine for their Scala process for photo films. In this machine you can normaly develop films with a maximum length of 5 meters.
But your S8 PanX Reverso film has 15 meters length.
Therefore Photo Studio 13 would have to build a complete new frame for 15 meters film length. That do cost. And it only makes sense if there is enough demand.
If you could guarantee that you send them at least 20 films p.a., then they could do it building such a special frame.

Best regards,
Henning

Henning. Thank-you. Hence my original question Who, if anyone, who develops cinefilm, also offers the Scala process?

Also - am I naive in asking, why is the Scala process such a secret, given that Agfa no longer exist?

Henning Serger · Aug 26, 2015

mr.datsun said:
Henning. Thank-you. Hence my original question Who, if anyone, who develops cinefilm, also offers the Scala process?

Currently AFAIK no one.

mr.datsun said:
Also - am I naive in asking, why is the Scala process such a secret, given that Agfa no longer exist?

Well, Agfa is alive and well, the part for industrial products in Belgium, including film.
The Scala process is not such a secret. I've seen it in the lab.
It is working with a real second exposure. Not with a chemical step like with the E6 process.
The first developer is the same as in the E6 process. The second developer is the only "secret" of the chemical manufacturer. Originally dichromate was used for bleaching. Now Kaliumpermanganat is used (because of current EU regulations). That's it.

And no, I don't have the formula for the second developer .

Best regards,
Henning

mr.datsun · Aug 27, 2015

Henning Serger said:
Currently AFAIK no one.

Well, Agfa is alive and well, the part for industrial products in Belgium, including film.
The Scala process is not such a secret. I've seen it in the lab.
It is working with a real second exposure. Not with a chemical step like with the E6 process.
The first developer is the same as in the E6 process. The second developer is the only "secret" of the chemical manufacturer. Originally dichromate was used for bleaching. Now Kaliumpermanganat is used (because of current EU regulations). That's it.

And no, I don't have the formula for the second developer .

Best regards,
Henning

Henning.

Interesting that they now use a permanganate bleach. So maybe that is not the cause of my own reversal development problems experienced with Foma (flatness).

Why do they use the E6 phenidone-type developer for the first development?

Someone must know the 2nd developer. So, is the second developer the secret behind the quality of image, in this case? Does this seem to contradict the usual idea that the 2nd developer is not so important?

btw. if dichromate cannot be used EU-wide, how to Bellini provide it?

miha · Aug 27, 2015

Jobo has a solution now: http://www.fotoimpex.de/shopen/darkroom/jobo-expert-super-8-developing-drum.html

It might be viable for some despite the high price tag.

Henning Serger · Aug 27, 2015

mr.datsun said:
Why do they use the E6 phenidone-type developer for the first development?

I think
- because it works as intended
- it is easily available in best quality
because
- the manufacturer of the Scala chemistry is also a manufacturer of E6 chemistry.
But only the manufacturer exactly knows why.

mr.datsun said:
Someone must know the 2nd developer.

The manufacturer. No one else. Period.

mr.datsun said:
btw. if dichromate cannot be used EU-wide, how to Bellini provide it?

I am not an expert in EU regulation, but as far as I remember it had to do with waste management / recycling with the bigger volumes at a professional lab why the Scala process was modified to Kaliumpermanganat.

You want Scala chemistry? Just buy it from the distributor (Saal). But you have to order quite a lot.....

Best regards,
Henning

mr.datsun · Aug 27, 2015

miha said:
Jobo has a solution now: http://www.fotoimpex.de/shopen/darkroom/jobo-expert-super-8-developing-drum.html

It might be viable for some despite the high price tag.

Wow. That's amazing.

I'm lucky in that i have a full-size Lomo. But for some pros, that would be great.

Does it mean that more people are taking S8 seriuosly?

mr.datsun · Aug 27, 2015

Henning Serger said:
You want Scala chemistry? Just buy it from the distributor (Saal). But you have to order quite a lot.....

Anyone want to go halves on a bottle?

But seriously, it does mean that a cinefilm lab could offer this.

Adox Pan-x Reverso Super8 (Silvermax) processed with Scala process?

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