Accounting for Dry-down

Sanjay Sen · Feb 10, 2008

I would be interested in hearing about how YOU account for dry-down when printing on FB papers. I've read of a number of ways of doing this - quick drying with a hair dryer or in the microwave, using a low-wattage bulb to view the test print, or doing a proper test to determine the dry-down factor.

I employ the hair dryer route, and find that the current paper I am using requires very little to no dry-down. Someday when I can spend enough time in the darkroom, I would like to do a proper test as Les describes on his website.

What do you do? Also, are there other ways to account for dry-down besides the ones mentioned above? Just curious...

TIA.

Best wishes,
Sanjay

David Brown · Feb 10, 2008

Sanjay Sen said:
Someday when I can spend enough time in the darkroom, I would like to do a proper test as Les describes on his website.

What do you do?

I did the test and now it's just part of the process. Invest the time. It's a lot shorter in the long run than doing test prints and using a hair dryer every time.

Chuck_P · Feb 10, 2008

I did a test with Ilford MGIV fiber using the info I read on Les's site and found that the dry down is about 8-10%----It only takes a little time to do the test as outlined by Les.

Vaughn · Feb 11, 2008

I just got to know the paper I was using and could tell from the wet print what the dry print would look like...I assumed about a 10% dry down on the Portriga Rapid and Ilford Gallerie I was using at the time. Now I am dealing with platinum printing and carbon printing that have a greater dry-down than silver gelatin and I do the same.

It is not that I am anti-testing, I just rarely do it...other than expose and develop negatives and make prints -- and pay attention to the results.

Vaughn

Sanjay Sen · Feb 11, 2008

I am beginning to think it would be a good idea to devote some time and do the tests. Thanks guys!

juan · Feb 11, 2008

I found the tests a waste of time. As part of my printing process, I dry the work prints in the microwave and then evaluate them for needed changes. I'm comparing dry print to dry print, which works better for me.
juan

thefizz · Feb 11, 2008

Chuck1 said:
I did a test with Ilford MGIV fiber using the info I read on Les's site and found that the dry down is about 8-10%----It only takes a little time to do the test as outlined by Les.

Ditto. I think in the long run its the easiest and best way.

panastasia · Feb 11, 2008

juan said:
I found the tests a waste of time. As part of my printing process, I dry the work prints in the microwave and then evaluate them for needed changes. I'm comparing dry print to dry print, which works better for me.
juan

I do it this way also, and I view the wet print under a light with moderately low wattage (40w) in the darkroom.

Paul

Skorzen · Feb 11, 2008

I heard about the microwave technique from AA's book and that's what I did last time, worked well.

Sanjay Sen · Feb 11, 2008

juan said:
I found the tests a waste of time. As part of my printing process, I dry the work prints in the microwave and then evaluate them for needed changes. I'm comparing dry print to dry print, which works better for me.
juan

But Juan, wouldn't it save time in the long run if you know the dry-down factor and avoid the wash-squegee-dry sequence? I understand you'd need to do the tests again with a different paper.

Harrigan · Feb 11, 2008

One way to get a quick measure of possible dry down effect is to squeegee the water off the surface of the print. When the print is wet it reflects light differently than when the surface is dry and this can really help me if I need a quick look at possible dry down. I find hair drying slow and a waste of power, but when in doubt fully drying the print is the best way to go. I find the microwave can really effect the paper gloss, making the paper very glossy and thus throws off the dry down for me (on glossy all I use for fb). Hair drying seems to do the same thing to a lesser degree.

Sometimes you can also look at a print at a stronger angle and it will also help show how the print may look when dry. I dont know why but some technical person on here can probably explain it.

juan · Feb 11, 2008

Sanjay Sen said:
But Juan, wouldn't it save time in the long run if you know the dry-down factor and avoid the wash-squegee-dry sequence? I understand you'd need to do the tests again with a different paper.

I don't think so. And I don't do a wash-squegee-dry sequence. In my darkroom, I have a large tray of water. I take the print from the fixer, dunk it in the water and swish it around for a few seconds. I have a few paper towels in the microwave, and pop the wet print on top for 50-seconds (8x10). I then stand the print up under my viewing light and I can compare the dry prints to one another as I make changes.

I find this a much more reliable method to arrive at a final print than trying to evaluate a wet print and make a percentage change. It could be just me, though.
juan

pesphoto · Feb 11, 2008

how long does it take to dry a print in the micro wave before it burts into flames?

walter23 · Feb 11, 2008

I just guess the effect now that I'm familiar with my main papers. I can get what I'm after without any trouble. I use a compressed air hose to dry a section of the test print to get an idea of the final density if it's really critical that I get it spot on.

Sanjay Sen · Feb 11, 2008

Juan, I think I see what you are saying: what I currently do is a little different - from the fixer the paper goes to a print washer for five minutes, then I squegee it, and then dry it with a hair dryer. So, that's a total of at least 10-12 minutes. Your process probably takes a couple of minutes, so much faster than what I do now.

Thanks for the inputs, guys.

Chazzy · Feb 11, 2008

juan said:
I don't think so. And I don't do a wash-squegee-dry sequence. In my darkroom, I have a large tray of water. I take the print from the fixer, dunk it in the water and swish it around for a few seconds. I have a few paper towels in the microwave, and pop the wet print on top for 50-seconds (8x10). I then stand the print up under my viewing light and I can compare the dry prints to one another as I make changes.

I find this a much more reliable method to arrive at a final print than trying to evaluate a wet print and make a percentage change. It could be just me, though.
juan

Can RC paper be dried in the microwave, or will the resin "fry"?

Dan Williams · Feb 11, 2008

Chazzy said:
Can RC paper be dried in the microwave, or will the resin "fry"?

Use a hair dryer for RC. A microwave will cause it to blister and bubble.

I have a microwave in my darkroom but I use it mostly to warm solutions. I have calibrated my print timer (RH Designs StopClock) for the papers I use. It has a dry-down compensation function built in that works great. I make my test strips with the compensation turned off. When I get a test that looks right wet, I turn on the compensation and the printing time will automatically be reduced by the percentage that I calculated during my calibration process.

Dan

thefizz · Feb 12, 2008

DarkroomDan said:
I have calibrated my print timer (RH Designs StopClock) for the papers I use. It has a dry-down compensation function built in that works great. I make my test strips with the compensation turned off. When I get a test that looks right wet, I turn on the compensation and the printing time will automatically be reduced by the percentage that I calculated during my calibration process.

Dan

Now that sounds perfect.

hywel · Feb 12, 2008

I'm with Juan, except that I do squeegee and then it's only 30 secs in my microwave.

jgjbowen · Feb 12, 2008

Go to www.circleofthesunproductions.com Bruce Barlow has the articles he wrote for View Camera a couple years ago. He explains how to do a dry down test and lists the dry down factors for numerous papers (alas many are no longer available). While you are there, check out his book on CD "Finely Focused" well worth the $$.

Personally, I use an old Zone VI drydown timer. Once the test is done and the dry down factor for the paper is known the rest is a breeze.

Good Luck

Sanjay Sen · Feb 12, 2008

Thanks John, for the article by Bruce. Unfortunately, the papers I use are not on that list. I'll need to do some tests with the paper(s) I use.

panastasia · Feb 12, 2008

jgjbowen said:
Personally, I use an old Zone VI drydown timer. Once the test is done and the dry down factor for the paper is known the rest is a breeze.

Good Luck

I also have one of those timers (compensating type for cold light intensity fluctuations) - good for mass production - but I always forget to reset the dial for the next (new) negative. I stopped using that function and rely only on the foolproof (more accurate, IMO) comparative method and microwave.

I'm getting older and more forgetful. The truth is: the timer does correct for dry-down very accurately.

Accounting for Dry-down

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