Accessory Box ideas

SchwinnParamount · Apr 11, 2005

I am building a few wooden dovetail jointed boxes for myself and a couple of friends for our LF cameras and associated equipment. These boxes are meant to be brought along on a shoot or used to store the equipment. I have a few ideas about how I want to organize the inside of the boxes but thought it would be a good idea to ask experienced LF users what they have found useful or would want if they were looking for a box.

So far I have come up with the following: Slots in the vertical walls of the box to hold lensboards with lenses upright, compartments for tools, lens cloths...etc, and a section to keep film holders. I am making my film holder section so the holders are stacked together upright. The separator between the lens section and the others goes the full width and height of the box interior so no loose metal things wind up bouncing around in the lens section if the box is handled roughly.

Any other ideas?

Andy K · Apr 11, 2005

I am not an LF user, but have you considered a 'tray' type construction? Where you would have layered trays inside the box which can be lifted out. Kind of like a fishing tackle box but on a slightly larger scale. I use a tackle box for my 35mmm and mf accessories and find it very convenient as I don't end up digging through to find the piece I need.

Just my 2p.

jp80874 · Apr 11, 2005

Im curious why you want a box or boxes rather than bags? Maybe you are on to something I havent figured out. I shoot 4x5 and 8x10. For me a bag is lighter and offers more protective padding. The sections of my Tenba back pack can be changed as my gear changes. The bag is rain and dirt proof. I can carry it in a cart or on my back with a great suspension system. What advantage do you see in the box?

As to what to carry Paul Butzi did a good article on this. In his article he refers to another article. http://www.butzi.net/articles/largeformatkit.htm

John

Bruce Osgood · Apr 11, 2005

I would only add the ability to stand on it.

SchwinnParamount · Apr 11, 2005

jp80874 said:
Im curious why you want a box or boxes rather than bags? Maybe you are on to something I havent figured out. I shoot 4x5 and 8x10. For me a bag is lighter and offers more protective padding. The sections of my Tenba back pack can be changed as my gear changes. The bag is rain and dirt proof. I can carry it in a cart or on my back with a great suspension system. What advantage do you see in the box?

As to what to carry Paul Butzi did a good article on this. In his article he refers to another article. http://www.butzi.net/articles/largeformatkit.htm

John

That was an interesting article you attached. I can see the advantages of the bag except for a couple of things. The first is that I'm an avid amateur woodworker and love doing things with wood, and the second reason is that I would like to be able to stand on the box for those occasions where I have to raise the camera on the tripod over my head (Thanks Bruce )

I did notice that the Paul Butzi still carries boxes for his film holders. Ammo cans lack the sophistication of a dovetail joint but they point to the need for a rigid box.

Dave Wooten · Apr 11, 2005

Good Idea,

I am struggling with that now as I am not an avid wooker, and have been looking for good strong utility boxes to house large format..i.e. 14 x 17...It is hard to find cases of approx. 24" x 24" etc....also good idea to be able to stand on it or use as a work table. with this format you sort of pick your location and "set up camp"

Keep me informed of your progress.

Dave in Vegas

wfwhitaker · Apr 11, 2005

SchwinnParamount said:
Any other ideas?

Maybe add some wheels because I don't think you're going to want to carry it very far....

BradS · Apr 11, 2005

SchwinnParamount said:
<snip>
Any other ideas?

A box is really nice in the field. I have a case for my monorail camera. In the field, I use the case/box as a table, chair and dry place to set stuff down. It has just three compartments though - one for camera, one for lenses and one for everything else. I wish it had more.

I always carry a notebook and pens in the field. It would be really nice to have a provision in the lid of the box to stow these and perhaps, the light meter and a pocket calculator.

You might try to make a mock up of your design out of cardboard or something and trying it out with the gear you intend to carry.

Dave Wooten · Apr 11, 2005

Actually WF you are right.....I load up the jeep and take a modified 3 bicycled baby carriage to move all into attack position

What would be nice to have is a sturdy case to pack the camera in when it is in the jeep and to set out on the ground...also...I have in the pass shipped my lf stuff ahead of me when traveling across country and if the same box could be wrapped and used for that would be great.

SchwinnParamount · Apr 11, 2005

I'm glad I asked! You all have come up with some ideas I'd never have thought of.

Bruce Osgood · Apr 11, 2005

SchwinnParamount said:
I'm glad I asked! You all have come up with some ideas I'd never have thought of.

One other thing. You mention dovetail joinery. I think that type of joinery requires a substantial piece of wood to execute the pins and tails. Are you going to have to use thick walls which will become a VERY heavy box in use. If that's the case then wheels become an absolute must. For off sidewalk wheeling the wider the tire the better. If you're going to be dragging it about in sand/beach's then even wider wheels are a must. If using wheels, the type of wheel becomes a major concern. If your terrain is cement then you must find a wheel that will absorb the shocks that will otherwise be transmitted to the box and its' contents, something in the pneumatics. Hard-pack trails offer a little cushion but diameter plays an important part their. I wouldn't think about casters that you see on dollys either. Sounds like I'm trying to reinvent the wheel, I'm not, that's your job.

Nathan Smith · Apr 11, 2005

Please post some photos of your box when it's complete. You might even put together a quick article about it, I think this is something that a number of us would find interesting.

Thanks,
Nathan

Andy K · Apr 11, 2005

Bruce (Camclicker) said:
I would only add the ability to stand on it.

wfwhitaker said:
Maybe add some wheels because I don't think you're going to want to carry it very far....

Maybe something like this..?

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v223/Minitar1/MiscFiles/hmmm.jpg

Dave Wooten · Apr 11, 2005

SP,

(I'm a Specialized Stump Jumper myself)

Actually bicycle wheels work quite well even in rocky terrain....have not used them in sand....

a thought on the dovetail idea......you could ship the parts of the finished box design...flat .. and It could be glued together finished and or painted by the end user,

SchwinnParamount · Apr 11, 2005

Selling a box to APUG members? ... hmmm, interesting idea. I'll keep you all posted. I've used .5" poplar with half-blind dovetails sucessfully. As a box gets larger, I'd have to think about going to .75" poplar for structural stability. Then, weight might be an issue. Something to think about.

SchwinnParamount · Apr 11, 2005

Andy K said:
Maybe something like this..?

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v223/Minitar1/MiscFiles/hmmm.jpg

Perfect! Just call me Henry Ford!

Dave Wooten · Apr 11, 2005

could you use 1/2 inch plywood,,,and on the edges glue and screw your dovetail using a better wood of course that would take the dovetail. So around the periphy of the box, could be on the outside or inside, you would have like a 2 inch frame with the dove in? I am not a carpenter as you can tell, but I like the idea of the dove etc....to me the weight is not that important, but the strentgh and it being able to take more than a few bumps and grinds is.....if my jeep can't haul it then it is a tad bit heavy..

SchwinnParamount · Apr 11, 2005

Dave Wooten said:
SP,

(I'm a Specialized Stump Jumper myself)

Actually bicycle wheels work quite well even in rocky terrain....have not used them in sand....

a thought on the dovetail idea......you could ship the parts of the finished box design...flat .. and It could be glued together finished and or painted by the end user,

Oh a mountain biker eh? There's hope yet. My Paramount has never seen dirt except when it's a thin layer on the asphalt. Then of course, I clean it lovingly when I get home from a ride. I'm not a poser though. I've got a couple of modern racing rigs I ride in the competitive events.

That would be an interesting idea. Build a kit and let a buyer glue it up and finish it... something to think about. What do you suppose someone might pay for something like that?

jp80874 · Apr 11, 2005

SchwinnParamount said:
I did notice that the Paul Butzi still carries boxes for his film holders. Ammo cans lack the sophistication of a dovetail joint but they point to the need for a rigid box.

Good point. There are several soft packs on the market that allow the film holders to be mauled if you bump them or fall down. An alternative that I like is the cheap, small, light weight lunch cooler bags. I think someone suggested this idea here last fall when I was looking for a solution. The small soft coolers sold in discount stores for $12-$17 have a hard plastic liner. You have two kinds of impact protection, soft and hard shell. In addition you can shield the film from the sun, dirt and heat.

Any of these ideas will work. Perhaps the answer is in your perspective. I love fine woodworking also, but at age 65 I dont plan to carry much of it around unless its attached to a 12 gauge.

Dave mentioned a modified 3 bicycled baby carriage to move all into attack position I use one http://www.babyjogger.com/ that I bought on eBay. It has 20 wheels, sealed bearings, shock absorbers and a capacity of 100 lbs. The eBay seller was quite surprised when he politely asked about my baby. I said Little Linhof liked it very much..

Enjoy,

John Powers

SchwinnParamount · Apr 11, 2005

jp80874 said:
...

Any of these ideas will work. Perhaps the answer is in your perspective. I love fine woodworking also, but at age 65 I dont plan to carry much of it around unless its attached to a 12 gauge.

Dave mentioned a modified 3 bicycled baby carriage to move all into attack position I use one http://www.babyjogger.com/ that I bought on eBay. It has 20 wheels, sealed bearings, shock absorbers and a capacity of 100 lbs. The eBay seller was quite surprised when he politely asked about my baby. I said Little Linhof liked it very much..

Enjoy,

John Powers

I believe walnut is still the preferred gun stock material? I've thought about making one but I've got my hands full with everything else I'm doing. My wife already complains about being a photography/cycling/woodworking widow...

Baby Linhof. Better watch out, someone is going to say 'Linhof, wow! Now that's a GOOD idea. just call him Lin for short'

rbarker · Apr 11, 2005

I think my suggestion would be to design it to have a frame of strong hardwood, and then inset panels of 1/8" birch or mahogany plywood for the sides, back, and front. Perhaps something thicker for the bottom and top, particularly if you plan to stand on it. Alternatively, 1/4" solid stock could be used for the side panels, but you'd likely need to glue up narrower stock to make them. If you're hand-cutting the dovetails (I use a nice Japanese dozuki to cut mine), 1/4" stock is thick enough to work with.

I'd also suggest making the wheels easily detachable, so they can be stowed separately in the car. Otherwise, the whole thing gets unwieldy in the vehicle - both in terms of space, and moving around on the wheels when driving.

I, too, like the idea of having nested trays in at least one side of the case.

SchwinnParamount · Apr 11, 2005

rbarker said:
I think my suggestion would be to design it to have a frame of strong hardwood, and then inset panels of 1/8" birch or mahogany plywood for the sides, back, and front. Perhaps something thicker for the bottom and top, particularly if you plan to stand on it. Alternatively, 1/4" solid stock could be used for the side panels, but you'd likely need to glue up narrower stock to make them. If you're hand-cutting the dovetails (I use a nice Japanese dozuki to cut mine), 1/4" stock is thick enough to work with.

I'd also suggest making the wheels easily detachable, so they can be stowed separately in the car. Otherwise, the whole thing gets unwieldy in the vehicle - both in terms of space, and moving around on the wheels when driving.

I, too, like the idea of having nested trays in at least one side of the case.

I made a box earlier this mont of the same basic design I am thinking of for this one. It is much smaller... 14x9x8 (LxWxH). The sides were made from poplar .5x8 stock. That is great for the size box I made and sturdy as heck. But if I at least double the height, then gluing two 8" boards edge to edge with biscuits might work but perhaps they wouldn't stand as much abuse as 1" mahogany hardwood plywood would stand. The varnish over the stain would have to be multi-coated and water resistant.

I just picked up a Forrest Woodworker II and that blade cuts through the hardest of my rock maple boards like butter! I even cut a 2mm thick strip of red oak with it and the surfaces were so smooth, I was tempted to chuck my sander in the ditch.

The wheels could be removable with cotter pins but I think the axle would have to slide out to keep from gouging auto apolstery.

smieglitz · Apr 12, 2005

SchwinnParamount said:
...The wheels could be removable with cotter pins but I think the axle would have to slide out to keep from gouging auto apolstery.

Last summer I built a large box for my 11x14 and picked up a used 3-wheel baby jogging stroller for twenty bucks. Wheels are about 20" in diameter and go down wooded paths nicely. A welder friend of mine added a couple brackets to the frame and some large washers. I'm able to strap the box securely to the frame using bungee cords through the washers. The wheels and axles are held by cotter pins as you suggest and once removed I can fold the frame up and put it in the back seat of my car in about 1 minutes time. The box goes in the trunk. The box is quickly removable from the frame, has a handle to help move it around, and is sturdy enough to stand on if I need to.

I also designed the box to be slightly larger than I needed for the 11x14. I line the inside with large-cell bubble wrap to lessen vibrations. If I choose, I can pack my 5x7 and medium format systems in separate padded cases in place of the larger camera. There is enough room so a pair of small coolers (one for drinks and lunch, the other for film holders) can be set inside the box if the two camera cases are there instead of the big camera. I even toss in a small expanding hoop reflector panel. I use bungee cords to strap a tripod and portable stepstool/toolbox to the buggy frame at the washers. I keep meters, filters, darkcloth, etc, in the stepstool. If I keep the baby seat on the frame, I can also throw some small stuff (water bottles, lunch, etc.) on that.

I've used it a couple times and so far I don't see any shortcomings to this approach. Might be nice to have a brake on the buggy though, just in case you need it.

Joe

jp80874 · Apr 12, 2005

smieglitz said:
Might be nice to have a brake on the buggy though, just in case you need it.

Joe

Joe,

The brake is very helpful. On my stoller http://www.babyjogger.com/ the squeeze control is mounted on the push bar. The brake is on the front wheel only. The brake helps keep you in charge going down hill. It also has a push button parking feature to keep the rig in place if you stop on a grade. This is particularly nice when you stop to look over a possible photo site. Your mind is on the image and you dont suddenly want to look back to find your camera and rig is rolling toward the edge of a cliff.

John

Dave Wooten · Apr 12, 2005

Brakes are good! mine locks the back axel, ( I heard next seasons model will have steering and air and sat radio} seriously though I have a canopy that can be pulled over everything, and have used it once or twice....

you find that with these rigs you can easily take quite a bit of stuff and over some pretty challenging terrain.

Not a problem to take a few more of your toys and enjoy them. Yea even more than one format! With the combination of Schwinn's sturdy box designs, and the expertise of you engineering apugers out there, a modular concept all terrain vehicle could be designed that would revolutionize the large format industry, we could really accessorize, nay, it would create the ultra ultra large format industry-the vehicles would have names like THE O'SULLIVAN,THE JACKSON AND POWELL, yes THE MAGNUM and THE JEROBOAM. Hey we've got a caravan! Galli could bring every one of his lenses and give demos and lectures and Steve could do a feature story in View Camera
and we'd have our own convention.

I have pulled this vehicle over logs by grasping the front wheel etc. fairly effortless, also a feature, the front wheel can be removed and attached to the back of a bicycle.

With these vehicles we Apprentice Geezers can assualt the landscape in grand style, set up a nice spread, break out a fine bottle of vino to sharpen the senses and the focusing eye....I am serious, really, no I mean really.

Dave in Vegas

Accessory Box ideas

SchwinnParamount

Andy K

jp80874

Bruce Osgood

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Dave Wooten

wfwhitaker

BradS

Dave Wooten

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Andy K

Dave Wooten

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Dave Wooten

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jp80874

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rbarker

SchwinnParamount

smieglitz

jp80874

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