A New Kentmere Fan

Ben 4 · Jun 19, 2006

As a former fan of the discontinued Polymax FA, I have been following with great interest the recent discussions of replacements for that lovely paper. I have also been engaged in my own quest for a substitute, which has taken me through experiments with Ilford's Multigrade (certainly good, but not quite neutral enough for my tastes) and Forte's Polygrade (impressive in many ways, but--depending on developer and toning--either too warm or too cold). I finally got around to trying Kentmere's Fineprint VC fiber paper this weekend. I had long hesitated because of the limited number of vendors in the U.S. and the recent reports of troubles with various Kentmere papers. My impression? I think it's love at first sight--this is a beautiful paper! For those who are interested, here are some more specific observations. For the record, the Kentmere is the air-dried glossy and was developed in Multigrade developer.

1. The image tone is dead neutral (which makes me happy!). A heavily selinium-toned Multigrade print of the same negative looks warm (well just slightly) by comparison. At the same time it lacks the blue tint that I've seen in Forte with coldtone developers.

2. The air-dried glossy surface is brilliant; it is decidedly glossier than either the Ilford or the Forte. The surface of the paper does have a bit more texture than those others (which is neither here nor there in my book).

3. The paper base is as white as the Ilford (and both are whiter than the Forte).

4. This paper is fast! I'm typically printing at about half the Ilford times (using each manufacturer's constant exposure settings for color heads)

5. My sample (limited to one 25 sheet pack of 8x10) was quite flat (I'm talking about curl, not contrast) out of the package (some have reported different experiences) and dried relatively flat as well. (Could have been this weekend's humid weather, of course. Time will tell.)

6. I have not tested the contrast range of the paper, but the published data do show a more limited range than Ilford's at both ends of the scale.

7. A preliminary stab at selenium toning (just my test strips) at 1:20 showed very little color change out to 7 or 8 minutes. I toned one strip for ten minutes, and it did develop a hint of purple in the shadows. But none of the ugly reds I got with the Forte.

So I think I've found a new favorite. I'm keeping my fingers crossed for the quality control.

--Ben

vet173 · Jun 19, 2006

I recently tried the kentmere paper and was real pleased with it also. I used the bromide paper, not the vc.

Ian Grant · Jun 19, 2006

Even in the Uk Kentmere papers are under-valued, I guess I first used their papers in the 70's but even here there are few outlets.

However they make a great range of papers, and since they employed a new emulsion chemist a few years a go have really grown in maturity. He brought the consistency and also variable contrast technology, and expanded the paper range.

I remember his job being advertised in the British Journal of Photography, and I guessed which company he probably left for them as well

Ian

Ben 4 · Jun 19, 2006

Ian Grant said:
However they make a great range of papers, and since they employed a new emulsion chemist a few years a go have really grown in maturity. He brought the consistency and also variable contrast technology, and expanded the paper range.

I remember his job being advertised in the British Journal of Photography, and I guessed which company he probably left for them as well

Ian

Perhaps that's why the phrase "channeling Polymax" came to mind to describe Fineprint!

One oddity I forgot to mention: the insert in the Fineprint package was for VC Select, their RC paper! But the paper itself is the right stuff (and the filter settings appear to be the same for both papers).

--Ben

RalphLambrecht · Jun 19, 2006

Ben

I'm glad you found a new love. Now do yourself the favor and call them up, because the word on the street is that they are not putting any effort into traditional photo research anymore, but spend our purchase $ on inkjet stuff.

Petzi · Jun 19, 2006

If it is so, then they should make up their mind. Two major manufacturers left the market, they have an opportunity to gain an entirely new position in the market.

Gary Holliday · Jun 19, 2006

RalphLambrecht said:
Ben

I'm glad you found a new love. Now do yourself the favor and call them up, because the word on the street is that they are not putting any effort into traditional photo research anymore, but spend our purchase $ on inkjet stuff.

Kentmere are working on the new Art range!!

Bob F. · Jun 19, 2006

It's not quite as white, but you'd need a densitometer to tell the difference. Ditto with the black.

I find it faster than MGIV, but only by about 1/3 to 1/2 a stop.

I also find it dries a little flatter than MGIV - but not important to me as I flatten in a drymount press.

According to my tests the contrast range is similar, looking on a graph, but I've not calculated the actual values

Bear in mind that there is a tendency for people with a problem (be it with Kentmere, Ilford, Kodak or Fujifilm etc) to ask about it on APUG so it's easy to get a slewed idea.

As for rumours, I think we've had quite enough of them in the last year or so.

Cheers, Bob.

Fineprint Vs MGIV contrast graph (roughly speed matched for clarity):

jovo · Jun 19, 2006

I've been using Kentmere VC for a while...well...one box of 50 11x14 so far. I agree with Ben about the speed; it comes up in the developer within the first 30 seconds and has much faster exposure times than Ilford. But, its cold, neutral tone doesn't work with a lot of my images as favorably as Ilford, and its more limited range of contrast limits it as well for my taste. Still, for some subjects it's a very nice paper and I found it warms up to a very slight tinge of pink in KRST 1 to 10 in under 5 minutes. It's great to still have some choices and I will continue to keep it on hand as an alternative to Ilford for the work that suits it well.

RalphLambrecht · Jun 20, 2006

I wish they would tell their distributors. Silverprint in London knows nothing about that. How did you find out?

Gary Holliday · Jun 20, 2006

RalphLambrecht said:
I wish they would tell their distributors. Silverprint in London knows nothing about that. How did you find out?

I think this is directed at me, but here's the info:

Dear Garry

The Art range has been discontinued for the present time due to the company, which supplied us with the base, closing down. We are at present trying to source a new base to the same specifications as we require but this takes time. With regards to the black print boxes, sorry- unfortunately we do not supply those.

Best regards

Theresa Swarbrick
Kentmere Photographic

doughowk · Jun 20, 2006

Of there various offerings, I've only been using their Bromide paper (for about 1 year) which has become my favorite cooltone paper. This morning I was printing a negative that with Oriental Segull VC looked flat. Printed with Kentmere Bromide grade 3 but too contrasty, so tried a couple of methods to reduce contrast. (there was a url link here which no longer exists) had suggested stand development for paper contrast control - place print in developer, and after initial agitation, let print sit in tray for remainder of dev time. I also used the water bath development method; and both methods yielded around grade 2 1/2. I'm now considering trying some of their other papers

Willie Jan · Jun 21, 2006

i used the kentmere baryta fineprint vc for a wedding album and like the tone, quality of the paper and nice black it produces. It also tones very good with sepia. I will certainly use it more in the future.
I tested the foma papers too, but they do not get so black as the kentmere does & it always after drying curles up as it was on the roll...

Willie Jan.

Ben 4 · Jun 21, 2006

Following Ralph's suggestion, I have sent a note of appreciation to the folks at Kentmere. I received a nice thank you in return.

--Ben

dphphoto · Jun 21, 2006

The more fans that Kentmere has, the better. We all need to buy as much as possible, so they'll keep making the stuff.
Other than some problems with flatness, I've liked the Fineprint VC very much. I've seen in some other threads that some people don't think the blacks are as deep as some other papers, but I don't have access to a densitometer, and can't test. The blacks look fine to me. And the highlights are spectacular.
I've tried Varycon lately. Weird stuff, it looks almost fogged with some negs. But it's great for contacting 8X10, and has a very long scale, almost like Azo. (I know I'll could catch some flak for that statement!) Dean

Mike A · Jun 21, 2006

dphphoto said:
The more fans that Kentmere has, the better. We all need to buy as much as possible, so they'll keep making the stuff.
Other than some problems with flatness, I've liked the Fineprint VC very much. I've seen in some other threads that some people don't think the blacks are as deep as some other papers, but I don't have access to a densitometer, and can't test. The blacks look fine to me. And the highlights are spectacular.
I've tried Varycon lately. Weird stuff, it looks almost fogged with some negs. But it's great for contacting 8X10, and has a very long scale, almost like Azo. (I know I'll could catch some flak for that statement!) Dean

I'm a contact print with Kentmeres Bromide, where do you find Varycon?

Mike A

Mike A · Jun 22, 2006

I'm also bad at typing, sorry.

Sjixxxy · Jun 22, 2006

Ben 4 said:
4. This paper is fast! I'm typically printing at about half the Ilford times (using each manufacturer's constant exposure settings for color heads)

Develops fast too. I was using Forte Polywarmtone in Ethol LPD 1:4 before using the kentmere/luminos. The poly was taking like 5 minutes before I'd pull the print.

Using the same developer & ratio with the Kentmere, I was pulling them out of the developer at 1:20. Kind of blew my mind at first.

Jack Lusted · Jun 22, 2006

Kentmere has established itself as my paper of choice both as RC and fiber. I've recently been trying out the 'fine print warm tone' - very different from the Ilford WT, a much more ivory base.
As yet I'm unsure about the Kentmere WT, might work well with high key portraits.
Any one else given this paper a go?

Bob F. · Jun 22, 2006

dphphoto said:
I've seen in some other threads that some people don't think the blacks are as deep as some other papers, but I don't have access to a densitometer, and can't test. The blacks look fine to me.
Dean

See the attachment to my post above: it shows Fineprint's Dmax at about 1/3rd of a stop lower than Ilford MGIV, which I for one simply cannot see by eye.

Jack Lusted said:
As yet I'm unsure about the Kentmere WT, might work well with high key portraits. Any one else given this paper a go?

There is an image of a tulip in my gallery here using the Warm version. I've not used it a great deal, but find it very nice for natural subjects such as flowers and other still-lifes. I suspect it will be good for portraits too but I never shoot those so can't really say.

Cheers, Bob.

Mark Layne · Jun 22, 2006

In this Kentmere lovefest let us not forget the magnificence of Kentona and the spendour of their Bromide.
Why will someone not make an ivory based glossy surface
Mark

Harrigan · Jun 22, 2006

Mark Layne said:
In this Kentmere lovefest let us not forget the magnificence of Kentona and the spendour of their Bromide.
Why will someone not make an ivory based glossy surface
Mark

Mark try the Fomatone mg classic glossy it has an ivory base. Freestyle has it in stock and J & C lists it but its never in stock. JC has a better price but they have not answered any of my emails inthe past 6 months about the paper so I assume they don't stock it anymore.

dbltap · Jun 28, 2006

just printed with some Art Classic tonite. haven't printed with fibre for a long time, so had to make some internal adjustments. So much slower than Agfa MCC. Anyway, seems to do ok, KRST doesn't have too much effect, but PF copper does. Think I will like the surface texture, a little rough, such as on watercolor papers, which is what I have been looking for. Going to try Foma chamois next week.
JIM

ineffablething · Jun 30, 2006

I've had a lot of trouble with Kentona. When I make contact prints on 8x10, the black edges flake off in the chemistry and wash. I've tried everything I could think of, but still get flaking. This has happened with multiple boxes. Disappointing.

W.

Bob F. · Jun 30, 2006

ineffablething said:
I've had a lot of trouble with Kentona. When I make contact prints on 8x10, the black edges flake off in the chemistry and wash. I've tried everything I could think of, but still get flaking. This has happened with multiple boxes. Disappointing.

W.

How long are you washing for? Seems a good idea to keep it as short as possible with some of the Kentmere papers (though I've had Fineprint in the wash overnight before now).

Cheers, Bob.

A New Kentmere Fan

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