4X5 film developing options?

nsurit · Dec 4, 2006

What are the best options for developing 4X5 film. Specifically, I'm interested in what I anticipate to be a fairly low volume need. I've used the big hard rubber tanks and stainless holders in another life, however doubt that would be the best way to go for my current needs. There seem to be several different styles of tanks for doing small lots. What are you using, with which you are pleased? The one option I know I won't use is a tray. I would like a daylite option and one with little danger of scratching your emulsion. Thanks in advance. Bill Barber

Ryuji · Dec 4, 2006

I can suggest two scratch-free methods but they need total darkness. I don't think there's a good scratch-free daylight processing method that gives even development.

There are stainless steel tanks that take as few as 6 hangers. Those require about 2 liters of solution. But you can keep reusing the same developer solution if you adapt a proper replenishing method, so it's very easy and economical.

Another good option would be to make a slosher with plexiglass and screws. Use it in a large tray, like 11x14 or 16x20 tray.

reellis67 · Dec 4, 2006

For low volume you can easily use a 4-reel stainles steel tank and process one sheet at a time. I've got two so I can do two sheets at a time using stand development, but you can do regular development with this method as well. There is also the Combi-Plan tank for daylight, but you'll get a lot of negative comments about it. In my experience it works fine as long as you're not trying to do 3-5 minute development times and you follow the directions about the fill spout. My times run around 8-15 minutes depending, so it works great and it allows for multiple sheets at one time. Then there are BZTS tubes, but they're not all daylight like the other options I listed.

I should also add that with the tanks listed above, I've never once scratched a negative.

- Randy

Konical · Dec 4, 2006

Good Evening, Bill,

The two criteria stated in you next-to-last sentence are easily (and cheaply) met with drum processing. No need to elaborate here. A Forum search under "Drum" or "unicolor" or "Chromega" or "rotary" will provide numerous entries with lots of information and not a few informed opinions. We've pretty well beaten the topic to death!

Konical

konakoa · Dec 4, 2006

As Randy described above, his method is sometimes also called the 'taco' method. Film is curved and held in a u-shape with rubber bands, then put in a daylight film tank (no reel) and processed just like roll film. I'm also a low-volume shooter, so I just process two sheets at a time in in a Paterson universal super system 4 (holds two 35mm, or one 120 reel) tank. 4x5 needs a good amount of developer (800ml) to stay submerged in the Paterson, so I like Xtol at 1:2 -- 250ml of developer, 550ml of water.

I've had great success with this method, and haven't scratched a single sheet in the last two boxes of film I've gone through. I also have a Jobo 2521 (the smallest Jobo 4x5 tank) that I have had a lot of trouble with in getting even development. I really wanted the Jobo to work, but the plain old Paterson has been the best for me (35mm, 120 and now 4x5 with the same old tank I've had for years!) so far.

jeroldharter · Dec 4, 2006

Use a Summitech slosher tray (not daylight) and also sold through Photographer's Formulary. Minimal dark time and relatively low chemistry volumes. Otherwise, the BTZS tubes sound OK.

grahamp · Dec 5, 2006

These days I use a Jobo CPE and 6-sheet reels for most of my 5x4. But for a year or two I used single-sheet pipe tanks - Dead Link Removed - with the inversion method. I still use it for the odd 1-2 sheets that do not warrant warming up the Jobo. I have not had any problems with scratching, and once loaded they are just like any other daylight tank.

JBrunner · Dec 5, 2006

Combiplan. Some hate it, some like it. Follow the directions about the venting, and filling, and seal it by running your fingers over the top edge, and you will probably like it. Some complaints about it are from poor usage, and some are from Combi's QC. If you get a real leaker, send it back for a new one. Worth the trouble.

noseoil · Dec 5, 2006

I still like the black abs plastic tubes for development. You can make them from plumbing parts and work mostly with the lights on. Article in the how "to section" to explain the process. Good for minimal agitation and stand development. tim

Sportera · Dec 5, 2006

Im with Jason, Combiplan works for me. I can process six sheets at a time, but I know of another photographer that does the Taco method and I am considering this when I only have a few sheets to dev., less chemistry involved.

Keith Tapscott. · Dec 5, 2006

I would like to see Paterson design a deeper version of their `Orbital` specifically for processing B&W sheet films.
If enough people ask them, then they may consider doing so.

fschifano · Dec 5, 2006

The CombiPlan works for me too. Mine doesn't leak too much - certainly not enough to be concerned about. Takes a bit of practice to get the sheets loaded right and to set the little clamp on top just right to keep the film from moving around during agitation, but otherwise ok it's ok.

Steve Smith · Dec 6, 2006

Keith Tapscott. said:
I would like to see Paterson design a deeper version of their `Orbital` specifically for processing B&W sheet films.
If enough people ask them, then they may consider doing so.

Why would you want it deeper? My Orbital develops B&W sheet films fine as it is.

Steve.

John Bartley · Dec 6, 2006

noseoil said:
I still like the black abs plastic tubes for development. You can make them from plumbing parts and work mostly with the lights on. Article in the how "to section" to explain the process. Good for minimal agitation and stand development. tim

I second what Tim says - tube development is (in my opinion) the cheapest, simplest and least space consuming way to do sheet film developing. I take it a step further on the cheap side though .... I don't use a screen, but rather let the AH layer wash off in a sink during the final wash.

cheers

Rolleiflexible · Dec 6, 2006

Bill, I am surprised no one here advocated the 2500-series Jobo tanks and reels for developing 4x5 sheets. I've used them for years and swear by them. You don't need the complete Jobo system -- just use the tanks and reels without the Jobo base. You can agitate by rolling the tank back and forth on your countertop, or spend $20 for an old motorized Beseler or Chromega or Unicolor roller base. Each reel holds up to six sheets, and the various 2500-series tanks hold from 1 to 4 reels each. Perfect uniform results every time. Sanders.

Neal · Dec 7, 2006

I would like to second the suggestion from Sanders. The 252X tanks are handy for even one sheet as they use such a small fluid volume.

Neal Wydra

Ole · Dec 7, 2006

"Thirded".

But for one or two sheets, just leave out the reel and put the films up against the wall. If you're extra luckym your 25xx tank is a 28xx tank in disgise, and has the "paper drum" ribs on the inside. I use the paper drums for films larger than 4x5" - up to 12x16". And my 2521 tank has paper drum ribs.

Keith Tapscott. · Dec 8, 2006

Steve Smith said:
Why would you want it deeper? My Orbital develops B&W sheet films fine as it is.

Steve.

Because I would like it to have a ribbed floor and I feel more confident with a little more processing solution volumes.

Steve Smith · Dec 9, 2006

Keith Tapscott. said:
Because I would like it to have a ribbed floor and I feel more confident with a little more processing solution volumes.

I know what you mean about confidence with the amount of solution. I had to try it out myself with the lid off to convince myself that it had enough solution to work!

And I agree that a ribbed floor would be good although I have scored mine with a knife to prevent the film from sticking. Other people have added dabs of glue, etc. to achieve the same thing.

Steve.

buze · Dec 16, 2006

I gouged my Orbital and the film never sticks.. I can use it with as little as 150ml of DDX 1+9 and get perfect development. I'm sure a good, even agitation is necessary tho, 150ml doesn't cover the film completely.
I do 8 "turns" per minute, at a reasonable speed : just under the speed where you can hear the solution "slosh" in the tray.

When I use Barry Thornson 2 baths formula, I use about 250ml for 4 sheets, since I reuse the dev it matters less. I found that /more/ solution can have it spill out if not careful during agitation...

Sometime I wish I had a way to process more film at the same time, but the other options are rather impractical and/or not very economical.

mikebarger · Dec 16, 2006

I like the dirt cheap jobo 4323 tank with the 2021 reels. You could do up to 12 sheets in a tank, but I never use the center slot on either reel.

I use a unicolor base for rotation.

I like it so well I've not tried any other method.

Mike

Curt · Dec 16, 2006

I like the hard rubber tanks and stainless steel hangers myself.

Curt

Peter Black · Dec 16, 2006

Keith, Steve, Buze

Are you using the motor base for the orbital or just moving it by hand? Scary as it seems, you only need to use the cup measure of developer and it still works just fine. I remember someone arguing this with Roger Hicks some years ago in Darkroom User mag, and it was incredible just how little developer is actually needed, because the film is still wetted with developer even when the solution is sloshing round the opposite corner.

While I obviously haven't tried it with processing chemicals, I usually wash the film with the lid off and it is surprising how efficient the orbital is at keeping the film wet with a cup/measure of water when used with the motor base. Definitely worth the money if you haven't got one.

Keith Tapscott. · Dec 24, 2006

Peter Black said:
Keith, Steve, Buze

Are you using the motor base for the orbital or just moving it by hand? Scary as it seems, you only need to use the cup measure of developer and it still works just fine. I remember someone arguing this with Roger Hicks some years ago in Darkroom User mag, and it was incredible just how little developer is actually needed, because the film is still wetted with developer even when the solution is sloshing round the opposite corner.

While I obviously haven't tried it with processing chemicals, I usually wash the film with the lid off and it is surprising how efficient the orbital is at keeping the film wet with a cup/measure of water when used with the motor base. Definitely worth the money if you haven't got one.

The article of "How much developer" by Roger, was published in Camera & Darkroom, issue 39 #1 in 1999 and uses the Leitz/Stoeckler two-bath developer as an example (Page 18). In Kodak publication J-78 for D-76 developer, Kodak recommend 473ml (16 oz) of D-76 diluted 1+1 for each 135-36, and #120 roll of film and 946ml ( one quart) for two rolls.
Ilford are more conservative, but even they suggest a minimum of 100ml of stock solution for each film. That is not to say that smaller solution volumes wont work, but it is a safer option to heed the manufacturers recommendations, particularly if processing important films, hence the reason I would like to see a processing tank similar to the Paterson Orbital that is designed specifically for the processing of B&W sheet films. Considering that Paterson have ceased production of the Orbital long ago,would any one else using LF cameras, like to see Paterson design such a tank for sheet film processing?

Jim Chinn · Dec 24, 2006

Sanders McNew said:
Bill, I am surprised no one here advocated the 2500-series Jobo tanks and reels for developing 4x5 sheets. I've used them for years and swear by them. You don't need the complete Jobo system -- just use the tanks and reels without the Jobo base. You can agitate by rolling the tank back and forth on your countertop, or spend $20 for an old motorized Beseler or Chromega or Unicolor roller base. Each reel holds up to six sheets, and the various 2500-series tanks hold from 1 to 4 reels each. Perfect uniform results every time. Sanders.

I'll second this one. I do have the Jobo base, but the reels are easy to load and I have never had any problem with uneven development.

4X5 film developing options?

nsurit

Ryuji

reellis67

Konical

konakoa

jeroldharter

grahamp

JBrunner

Moderator

noseoil

Sportera

Keith Tapscott.

fschifano

Steve Smith

John Bartley

Rolleiflexible

Neal

Ole

Moderator

Keith Tapscott.

Steve Smith

buze

mikebarger

Curt

Peter Black

Keith Tapscott.

Jim Chinn

4X5 film developing options?

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