35mm b&w processing mystery...can anyone help?

Brian Stater · Oct 27, 2021

Hello Photrio members
I have been processing 35mm b&w films for a year or so, mostly quite successfully, but am mystified by the disaster of my latest effort. Can anyone explain what's gone wrong?

Here are the details....the film in question is Ilford Delta 100, processed in Ilfosol 3, both of which I have used in the past with no problem.
But when I pulled the latest film from the tank, every frame looked as though it had been shot in thick fog...and the dull grey sheen of the film extended beyond the individual frames to the margins of sprocket holes and so on.
I have uploaded two sample frames as they appeared when I attempted to scan them. Total disaster, but I can't work out what I've done wrong...

Any comments or advice? I'd be very grateful!!

Best wishes
Brian, in London.

pentaxuser · Oct 27, 2021

Brian, all I can do is to throw in a number of possibilities via questions. From the scan if this is an exact replica of the way the negs look then it might indicate under exposure or under development so are you sure that neither may have occurred?

When was the last time you used this particular Ilfosol and was there any signs of what we see here but to a much lesser extent such that the developer is on its way out?

Was the leader completely black as you'd expect from OK developer on a part of the film that was blasted from daylight?

Does thus grey look have a milky appearance over the whole negative? If this is the case then try re-fixing and washing very thoroughly to see if this veiled appearance is from the remains of fixture that hasn't been removed first time around

pentaxuser

MattKing · Oct 27, 2021

May we please see backlit photos of the negatives themselves, including the edges and spaces between the frames?

removed account4 · Oct 27, 2021

Hi Brian

When you say a thick green fog that extends past each frame, .. it makes me think the film for whatever reason is covered with dichroric fog ( sorry if I spelled it wrong ) it looks like a weird metallic green sheen. I've had film with that problem and when I had it the only way to get rid of it is by using "farmers reducer" to eat away at the metallic silver of the film and lighten the density of the image. if you go that route you will need to refix and rewash the image afterwards, good lucK!
John

Andrew Patteson · Oct 27, 2021

Sounds like incomplete fixing to me, but as Matt requests, seeing the negatives should help Dx.

Brian Stater · Oct 28, 2021

Thanks for those suggestions...the consensus seems to be that this is a fixing problem. To answer Pentaxuser's questions, yes, the leader was fine, jet black. And I last used the developer about 10 days previously, when it gave me perfect results.
To follow Matt's suggestion I shall post backlit images of the negs later today or tomorrow.
Thanks to all in the meantime.
Brian

petrk · Oct 28, 2021

You could complete the fixing inmediately. Just put negatives to fixer. Under the light you can inspect if the milky fog dissolves and negative clears. Add minute and you should be fine than.

Brian Stater · Oct 28, 2021

Thanks, I'll try that.

George Collier · Oct 31, 2021

The oddly colored areas around the selection frame (looks like these are screen captures of the scanning software preview) are what my preview looks like outside the selected scan area - even scanning in grayscale - to me normal.
It looks like it could be film fog to me, done after the film was removed from the camera. But like MattKing says, simple shots of the negs on a light table or similar backlit surface would help. Is there any difference to this effect in different places in the film? Is it worse in some places than others? If they are under fixed, wouldn't they have a creamy cast to them?

Brian Stater · Oct 31, 2021

Hello George
Thanks for your comments and suggestions. To answer your question: no, there is no difference in any part of the film, it is consistently weird! I have uploaded a backlit image of one small section, which I hope may tell you and MattKing something. Those few frames show a bit of buckling, where I struggled at first to get the film loaded on to the Hewes developing spiral, but I removed the film, started again, and it wound on smoothly.
As ever, I'd be grateful for any help on offer. Incidentally, I haven't yet had the chance to re-fix the fix, as other members have suggested.

Regards to all
Brian

MattKing · Oct 31, 2021

Re-fix that film in fresh fixer!
Then show us the results.

pentaxuser · Oct 31, 2021

MattKing said:
Re-fix that film in fresh fixer!
Then show us the results.

So is this pinkish colour the result of exhausted fixer, Matt. Not a challenge; it's just that I have never seen this effect on film and it's useful to know what the effect of exhausted fixer is .

Brian's original bad negs showed no sign of this pinkness

Thanks

pentaxuser

MattKing · Oct 31, 2021

pentaxuser said:
So is this pinkish colour the result of exhausted fixer, Matt.

I think that pink colour is probably an artifact of how it is being viewed under both transmitted and reflected light.

JPD · Oct 31, 2021

You are in London, and that could explain the fog. The film strip does look underfixed.

pentaxuser said:
Brian's original bad negs showed no sign of this pinkness

That could be due to the white balance colour correction by the camera/scanner.

mohmad khatab · Oct 31, 2021

MattKing said:
Re-fix that film in fresh fixer!
Then show us the results.

I totally agree with you
And in the event that the man does not have a new Fixer.
I advise him to filter the Fixer solution with a cotton swab and put it with the funnel and pour the solution on it until you purify it of any impurities.
Then he puts the film back on the tank and pours a fixer solution on it for at least five minutes and stirs it up for that period without stopping.

reddesert · Oct 31, 2021

Exhausted fixer may not fully remove dyes in the film (sensitizing or anti halation dyes) and that could cause some of the pinkish color.

The original post wouldn't have shown the same color, if that color is in the negatives, because the images in the original post are scans.

Brian Stater · Nov 3, 2021

Dear All
I have now had the chance to run my film through fresh Fixer and, happily, it has solved the problem. I'm very happy with the result -- and really grateful to everyone offered suggestions and advice.
Best wishes
Brian

MattKing · Nov 3, 2021

Great news.
Can you post the same sort of backlit image of the negatives, so we can have a before and after reference to refer others to who also have a problem with under-fixing?

Brian Stater · Nov 3, 2021

Hello Matt
Yes, good idea....I shall do that. I'm under the cosh with work just now but I shall post the images you suggest in the next day or so.

35mm b&w processing mystery...can anyone help?

Brian Stater

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