2x3 sheet film processing

[M Carter]

I have a combiplan, but there have been times I've shot 6x7 negs when i needed a one-off shot, for tests or oddball print ideas. I've done thing like cut pieces from 120 film, or cut 4x5 film in half and tape it into an RB back (I don't have the cut film holder). I adapted a plastic reel to hold 4x2.5" film (dremel and a glue gun), I can slide several sheets in there - handy and much easier to deal with than the combi.

 

[StepheKoontz]

Don't know if the Medium Format forum or the Large Format forum is the better place for this.

Anyway, I'm likely buying a Linhof baby Technika, and while my plan is to outfit it with a roll film back, it comes with the GG back and some film holders. I like Foma 100, and Freestyle has Arista 100 and 400, rebadged Foma, in the small size, so I figured I'd give that a try as well. So on to how to develop. I came across this 2x3 film holder that fits the paterson tank. Its a bit dear, but not that bad considering the likely low volume these sell at. Has anyone used these? Are they relatively easy to use? Any issues?

https://20thcenturycamera.com/colle...9-2x3-quick-load-6-sheet-film-processing-reel

I like the idea of this enough I ordered one. It uses the same tanks I use for any other film that I know I get consistent, even development with. I'll post again once it arrives and I give it a try.

 

[abruzzi]

I like the idea of this enough I ordered one. It uses the same tanks I use for any other film that I know I get consistent, even development with. I'll post again once it arrives and I give it a try.

I’d love to hear back once you get it. You’re a little ahead of me, I haven’t received the camera yet. I have a roll film holder for it, but I’d also like to muck about with sheet film for when I want to use a lens that doesn’t have a cam. I also just noticed that there are several different film holders for this camera, a 2 1/4 x 3 1/4, a 6.5x9, and a thicker one that seems intended for glass plates. I don’t know which holders are included, which would have an impact on how I develop them. (6.5x9 film also seems almost like unobtanium.)

 

[StepheKoontz]

I’d love to hear back once you get it.

The other advantage I see for 2 X 3 sheet film is flatness, both in the holder and when printing/scanning. That is one of the issues with using roll film for 6X9 is keeping it flat. The downside of sheet film is dust.

 

[Donald Qualls]

if more that few then I use hangers and deep tanks.

But once again, not everyone has the darkroom real estate for that. I think a Yankee is going on my list for next payday. I've found a bunch of exposed 4x5 film holders that have been waiting patiently for twelve years -- and I've got a jug of Df96 monobath. Possibly a good combination...

 

[abruzzi]

so, it turns out, after the camera arrived, the sheet film holders it came with are all 6.5x9, not 2 1/4 x 3 1/4. The only 6.5x9 film I can find is Electron microscope film, that I would have to order from Maco Direct. I guess there is FP4+ during the Ilford special order period, but are they even going to be doing that this year? Anyone know any other sources for 6.5x9 sheet film? I've read that 5x7 can be cut into 4 sheets, but I've never cut down film or paper, and would have to buy a guillotine to do that.

 

[Donald Qualls]

@abruzzi This is using modern type film holders, right? The kind that go under a spring back?

Good news. Just buy some 2x3 film holders and they'll fit the camera. I see them fairly cheaply on eBay as of a couple days ago. For Graphic Back cameras, 2x3 and 6.5x9 interchange on the same back, as do 3x4 and quarter plate, 4x5 and 9x12 cm, 5x7 and 13x18 cm, and 8x10 with 20x24 cm.

You must have the correct size film to fit the holders, but both holders in each size pair will fit the same camera.

 

[abruzzi]

I thought I read that the baby Linhof doesn't work with standard holders, and requires Linhof holders which are a bit more rare and expensive. I should do a bit of due diligence to confirm that.

 

[David A. Goldfarb]

I thought I read that the baby Linhof doesn't work with standard holders, and requires Linhof holders which are a bit more rare and expensive. I should do a bit of due diligence to confirm that.

No. Linhof holders are nice (if you have 6.5x9cm film), because they automatically pop the sheet of film out when you open the flap to unload in the dark, but the external dimensions are the same as a standard 2x3” holder or Grafmatic. I’ve used all three in my TechV 23b.

 

[abruzzi]

No. Linhof holders are nice (if you have 6.5x9cm film), because they automatically pop the sheet of film out when you open the flap to unload in the dark, but the external dimensions are the same as a standard 2x3” holder or Grafmatic. I’ve used all three in my TechV 23b.

Thanks for that. I must have read an incorrect statement. Unfortunately, their is a real dearth of information online concerning the little Technika, so I’m mostly stuck filtering through old forum threads.

 

[David A. Goldfarb]

If you get Grafmatics (or regular filmholders for that matter), just be sure to get Graphic type and not Graflex type. It's the same distinction as on 4x5" cameras. A Graphic-type holder has a lock rib on the holder that meshes with the groove in the spring back and may or may not have Graflok grooves on the sides. A Graflex-type holder for Graflex SLRs has a groove on the holder that meshes with a lock rib on the camera back and always has grooves on the sides.

I accidentally got a couple of Graflex type Grafmatics in a lot of Graphic type Grafmatics and didn't notice until I tried to cycle the film, and the Graflex type holder wouldn't stay in the camera back.

 

[mnemosyne]

so, it turns out, after the camera arrived, the sheet film holders it came with are all 6.5x9, not 2 1/4 x 3 1/4. The only 6.5x9 film I can find is Electron microscope film, that I would have to order from Maco Direct. I guess there is FP4+ during the Ilford special order period, but are they even going to be doing that this year? Anyone know any other sources for 6.5x9 sheet film? I've read that 5x7 can be cut into 4 sheets, but I've never cut down film or paper, and would have to buy a guillotine to do that.

The special order items aside, there are currently two films available that fit the spring loaded Linhof "6 1/2 x 9" precisely:

Fomapan 100 (format 6.4x8.9 cm), catalog number 11179
https://fomaobchod.cz/en/blackwhitenegativefilms/sheetfilms/fomapan100sheets/fomapan10064x89cm50ks[11179]?ItemIdx=20

Adox CHS 100 II
https://www.fotoimpex.com/films/ado...-25-blatt-65x9-cm-255x355-inch-25-sheets.html

Not sure about abroad, but in continental Europe they can be ordered directly through the webshops linked above.

 

[abruzzi]

The special order items aside, there are currently two films available that fit the spring loaded Linhof "6 1/2 x 9" precisely:

Fomapan 100 (format 6.4x8.9 cm), catalog number 11179
https://fomaobchod.cz/en/blackwhitenegativefilms/sheetfilms/fomapan100sheets/fomapan10064x89cm50ks[11179]?ItemIdx=20

Adox CHS 100 II
https://www.fotoimpex.com/films/ado...-25-blatt-65x9-cm-255x355-inch-25-sheets.html

Not sure about abroad, but in continental Europe they can be ordered directly through the webshops linked above.

thanks for that link. I saw several year old threads that mentioned the availability of CHS 100 II in 6.5x9, but every search I constructed in google found nothing except discussion in threads and no actual listings.

More and more, I’m finding google search now sucks.

unfortunately the Foma store will not ship to USA, but Fotoimpex will (though shipping is pretty high.)

 

[mnemosyne]

CHS100 II was not available for some years, it has only returned recently. In case you think about a larger purchase from Fotoimpex you might ask them if they can special order Foma 100 in that size for you. I remember I bought some Foma 100 in 6.5x9 from them ca. 3-4 years ago. At that time they still had it listed in their web shop.

 

[nosmok]

I'll chime in with my fix for the Yankee tank's need for buckets of chemistry-- closed-cell foam blocks! Get some 2" thick CC foam, cut a piece so you can wedge it in the tank where the film ain't. It worked all right with Caffenol; not up enough on chemistry to know if more dedicated developers would react with the foam. Certainly do a splash test first. I spilled enough agitating my Yankee to gladly pay the premium for the Nikor, but ymmv.

 

[Donald Qualls]

Sounds like a neat idea; I may have to make up a couple displacement blocks from HDPE cutting boards or similar, bonded with RTV silicon, and put pins in them to engage the rails in the tank's plates. And then just get out the big graduate if I need to process more than six sheets at a time.

I wouldn't expect most plastics to interact badly with normal chemistry. Paterson tanks are polypropylene, and I think the Yankee is as well; I've developed in ABS and PVC pipe, some plastic reels appear to be nylon, and I've even seen 3-D printed items used in developing (not sure if it was PLA or something else, though). Most modern trays are some kind of plastic (polypropylene again, I think). I've used polystyrene for measuring chemicals, only ever had trouble when I put 91% isopropyl alcohol in it and it crazed.

 

[juan]

I needed to reduce the size of a very large tank and cut one of the hard foam yoga blocks to fit. I found the block at my local Academy Sports - cheap. I used it with Pyrocat HD and saw no ill effects to either the film or the block.

 

[Donald Qualls]

I needed to reduce the size of a very large tank and cut one of the hard foam yoga blocks to fit. I found the block at my local Academy Sports - cheap. I used it with Pyrocat HD and saw no ill effects to either the film or the block.

As long as the foam is closed cell, it should be fine. Can't have it soaking up developer and holding it over for next time...

 

[MattKing]

Using developer in a replenishment regime is a really, really good solution for the "tank is too big" problem.

 

[Donald Qualls]

Replenishment, however, normally assumes you process a lot more film than I do. For short term, I'll be combining two quart-size batches of Df96 and adding time as I use up the capacity -- which you can also do with D-76, D-23, or Xtol stock. Longer term, I might consider Xtol (which is its own replenisher) for a replenished developer. I ran replenished D-23 for a few months once, but I don't like the developer itself much (I'd rather have Rodinal grain than the mushy D-23 result). I make my own Parodinal, so even with 55 ounces per tank of 4x5, it'll only cost about a quarter, and I'll be returning to reused fixer in order to control what goes down the drain (use it up and put in a bucket, rather than even one-shot into the septic).

 

[btaylor]

Using developer in a replenishment regime is a really, really good solution for the "tank is too big" problem.

+1. When I am doing sufficient volume the replenishment route is best- very consistent too. If doing one shot when I am not doing a lot of processing, Rodinal or HC110 at high dilution is really cheap.

 

[MattKing]

X-Tol replenished works great if you average at least a roll a week.
You may end up discarding a portion of each 5 litre batch - a roll a week is only 26 rolls in a six month period - but most people find that the 6 month storage recommendation is very conservative. And at $11.00 USD for a package, even if you waste half a package every six months, it isn't an expensive problem!

 

[Donald Qualls]

If doing one shot when I am not doing a lot of processing, Rodinal or HC110 at high dilution is really cheap.

Exactly. When I was a Costco member, I'd buy 1000 tablets of 500 mg Acetaminophen for about $11 specifically for making developer (that's just over a penny a tablet), and I figured a tank for two 35 mm or one 120 cost me about a nickel, even using distilled water at (then) 79 cents a gallon to mix it. I pay a bit more for the tablets now, but have RODI water on tap for "free", so even almost half a gallon of developer shouldn't run as high as fifty cents. And I'm also a fan of HC-110 Dilution H (1+63) as well as 1+127 (Ansel's dilution).

 

[StepheKoontz]

I like the idea of this enough I ordered one. It uses the same tanks I use for any other film that I know I get consistent, even development with. I'll post again once it arrives and I give it a try.

I received this custom reel a few weeks ago and just got done developing a dozen sheets in two batches. I'm using a single 120, two 35mm size patterson tank with it (I have 2 of these tanks I have been using for decades) and it works REALLY well. Once the reel is loaded with 6 sheets, it's just like developing a roll of 120 film. 500ml of developer, I'm using D76 1+1 so doesn't take a bunch of developer. It was easy to load and the only question I can't answer is how durable it is. I feel like as long as I don't abuse it or expose it to super high temps, it should be fine. It's not as cheap as I would like, but $50 isn't a ton of money to invest and allows consistency in my development across formats.

https://20thcenturycamera.com/colle...9-2x3-quick-load-6-sheet-film-processing-reel

 

[abruzzi]

yeah, I ordered one too, and it is reasonably well designed and made. That and the compatibility with patterson tanks makes it a good option for 2x3 and 6.5x9 (there are different reels for each size.) The make reels for larger sizes, but I can't say how well they'll work, and they need larger paterson tanks which increases the amount of developer needed.