220 film being discontinued?

taomeister · Oct 14, 2015

Hey there, I heard a troubling rumor that Kodak is discontinuing their last bastion of 220 film - Portra 160 and Portra 400.

Since these two stocks are (AFAIK in the USA) the only remaining stocks left that you can purchase from big retailers in 220 I'm worried those of use who shoot with 220 backs will get completely left for dead. Any confirmation on this? I can't seem to find any definitive press release discontinuing 220 for Portra 400 or 160.

Ektagraphic · Oct 14, 2015

Kodak has in fact discontinued 220 film. While it does not seem to be reflected on their website, I had contacted them to inquire and I got the typical response that due to decline in sales blah blah

taomeister · Oct 14, 2015

So basically there's no more 220 film of any stock that can be found for purchase. On a side topic then, there's no way to adapt 220 backs for 120 film or 35mm is there? That may be all one can do with them once stock runs out.

Poisson Du Jour · Oct 14, 2015

Kodak is not alone. So too is Fujifilm, having announced a few weeks back that all 220 format film will be discontinued in 2017. Along with Velvia in sheet film format (5x4 and 8x10), among other emulsions.

Scant few photographers use 220 film. That's a fact. They cannot cater for a miniscule market, nor does that make economic sense given the cost of film production.

Ken Nadvornick · Oct 14, 2015

I believe Ferrania has stated that they will have the capability to make and package 220 film. But of course they are still trying to get up and running with an initial E-6 ISO100 120 film.

Time will only tell if they can ever reach the point where the topic of 220 film becomes relevant to them.

Ken

taomeister · Oct 14, 2015

I think whomever is willing to go back in on a 220 black and white film can effectively have sole market position and garner a ton of goodwill... From me at least.

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ic-racer · Oct 14, 2015

Poisson Du Jour said:
Scant few photographers use 220 film. That's a fact.

The only reason I don't use 220 is they never made T-max in 220. Too bad because I got 220 backs for all my cameras back in the 80s.

flash26c · Oct 14, 2015

As far as I know, goodwill doesn't put food on the table. Let's be thank full that some films make money so they will continue to make it for our use.

Ken Nadvornick · Oct 14, 2015

taomeister said:
I think whomever is willing to go back in on a 220 black and white film can effectively have sole market position and garner a ton of goodwill... From me at least.

Well, their stated business model is to enter under-served or non-served film markets where there may still be levels of demand that will match their new reduced production capacities. As Yogi says, one never knows until one knows...

Ken

taomeister · Oct 14, 2015

Yeah my problem with 220 is that by the time I discovered it it was already effectively left for dead; Kodak was the only one still selling it in the states, and only Portra, and pricing it in a way that made it feel like they were pushing people out (a lot more than double the cost of 120).

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Sirius Glass · Oct 14, 2015

220 was never popular and has been loosing ground. When I bought the Hasselblad I thought that I would get some 220 backs only to discover there was no black & white 220 by anyone and a really limited selection of color. I passed on the 220 backs. Never missed them.

Sirius Glass · Oct 14, 2015

taomeister said:
So basically there's no more 220 film of any stock that can be found for purchase. On a side topic then, there's no way to adapt 220 backs for 120 film or 35mm is there? That may be all one can do with them once stock runs out.

A 220 Hasselblad back will only yield 11 negatives not 12, so close but no cigar. Why waste the film? I heard that they can be used as bookends.

Trail Images · Oct 14, 2015

So too is Fujifilm, having announced a few weeks back that all 220 format film will be discontinued in 2017. Along with Velvia in sheet film format (5x4 and 8x10), among other emulsions.

I was not up to date on the upcoming Velvia sheet film loss. As a strong user of Velvia 50 in 120 & 4x5 this is sad news......
I'd actually been buying from a source in Japan the 4x5, it was a smooth operation I was hoping to continue......

Roger Cole · Oct 14, 2015

Poisson Du Jour said:
Kodak is not alone. So too is Fujifilm, having announced a few weeks back that all 220 format film will be discontinued in 2017. Along with Velvia in sheet film format (5x4 and 8x10), among other emulsions.

Scant few photographers use 220 film. That's a fact. They cannot cater for a miniscule market, nor does that make economic sense given the cost of film production.

Eh, Velvia in sheet film??

I knew about 100F but not the 50. Is that going??

And of course few people use it because so few emulsions have been available and the ones that were cost more than twice as much per roll as 120 so unless you just really needed more shots without film changes (wedding photographers, very few of whom shoot film now) there was no real reason.

Poisson Du Jour · Oct 15, 2015

No Velvia 50 5x4 in Australia save for legacy inventories of it in retailers and on FleaBay. The 5x4 RVP50 was discontinued in the first tranche. Slowly but surely, Fujifilm is taking the goodies away from us. For me, I clutch Pooks the teddy tightly and hope for a couple more good years, at a minimum.

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Theo Sulphate · Oct 15, 2015

Sirius Glass said:
A 220 Hasselblad back will only yield 11 negatives not 12, so close but no cigar. Why waste the film? I heard that they can be used as bookends.

My understanding is:

120 film in A12 back = 12 exposures

220 film in A24 back = 24 exposures

120 film in A24 back = 11 exposures due to different frame spacing produced by the back, which isn't expecting a full-length paper-backed roll. There's also the issue of different thickness when using 120 in an A24 (220) back.

I could be wrong, I've been eating a lot of Cheetos.

Roger Cole · Oct 15, 2015

Poisson Du Jour said:
No Velvia 50 5x4 in Australia save for legacy inventories of it in retailers and on FleaBay. The 5x4 RVP50 was discontinued in the first tranche. Slowly but surely, Fujifilm is taking the goodies away from us. For me, I clutch Pooks the teddy tightly and hope for a couple more good years, at a minimum. 

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Ah, it's the Velvia 100 (non-F) that looks to still be available, at least here:

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/searc...ncy&ci=335&N=4093113314+4291439075+4129206585

mnemosyne · Oct 15, 2015

taomeister said:
Yeah my problem with 220 is that by the time I discovered it it was already effectively left for dead; Kodak was the only one still selling it in the states, and only Portra, and pricing it in a way that made it feel like they were pushing people out (a lot more than double the cost of 120).

a thread here not too long ago:

(there was a url link here which no longer exists)

taomeister · Oct 15, 2015

Thanks for that mnemosyne!

Alan W · Oct 15, 2015

Hormel used to sell pickled pigs feet in a nice looking jar.I don't see this product anymore.If Hormel could find enough people to buy the stuff they'd certainly continue producing it.The lack of a market for 220 film is not the fault of Kodak.Use plenty of 120 film or you might find yourself out of that too.

gone · Oct 15, 2015

There's more of a market for pickled pigs feet than there is for 220 film. And dem 'ol feets be still in de jars. Maybe if they put the film in brine water it would sell?

http://www.walmart.com/ip/Hormel-Pigs-Feet-9-Oz/10447796

I grew up in the South, been hanging out w/ black folks all my life, and never once saw anyone eat one of these things. Although when you think about it, why is eating one part of a dead animal worse or better than eating the other dead parts? Which is largely why I'm a vegan now. But in my prime I would eat anything, especially if I got drunk enough. Anything but pickled pigs feet that is. Yuk.

Never considered using 220 film. 12 exposures a roll is how (insert mythical deity of your choosing here) intended it to be (or 8 or 16).

Xmas · Oct 15, 2015

There is more edible on tje leg or knuckle, cept of you are Muslim or veggie.

Athiril · Oct 15, 2015

I bought 220 Velvia 50 while in Japan, it is cheaper than 120 per frame.

Trail Images · Oct 15, 2015

No Velvia 50 5x4 in Australia save for legacy inventories of it in retailers and on FleaBay. The 5x4 RVP50 was discontinued in the first tranche.

Sheet Velvia 50 has not been sold outside of Japan for a few years now as I recall. After the on line petition did not work it looked like it was a lost cause. However, there are a few sources in Japan that have shipped in the past on prepaid orders. So, I'm hoping those sources may remain intact, unless Fuji drops the product entirely of course.

pentaxuser · Oct 15, 2015

taomeister said:
On a side topic then, there's no way to adapt 220 backs for 120 film

I can't find what camera(s) you use but changing a 220 insert for the P645 to 120 is as I understand it relatively simple. GR Hazelton somewhere has given an explanation.

No good to you of course if you haven't got a P645.

pentaxuser

220 film being discontinued?

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