210mm Lens for Speed Graphic on Graflex 4x5

braxus · Mar 28, 2016

I'm wondering which lens would be the best to go with on my 4x5 Graflex camera? What I see on Ebay are some Schneider-Kreuznach Symmar 210mm f/5.6, a Rodenstock Sironar 210mm f/5.6, and a Fujinon 210mm f/5.6. Many have the Copal shutter. I'm looking for a lens that is good for both portraits and also landscape crops for closer view shot like tulips closer up, etc. I want a sharp lens and with good contrast in the $200 range. Must fully cover 4x5 film. Any suggestions? Many are in the same price range, so its hard to choose.

Also is there such a thing as an inexpensive 600mm lens for 4x5?

removed account4 · Mar 28, 2016

hi braxus: the symmar is a nice lens, and if you get a camera with long bellows you can remove the front element
and turn it into a 370mm lens. im not sure what graflex camera you have/want to use with these lenses but they would all
probably fit the bill. i only have and have knowledge about the schneider ... i've had mine for 20 years and can't complain.
you might also look for 203mm lenses. i believe kodak, wollensak, ilex and b+l i think all made them
they would have been from the 40-50s and might cost a little less than a the lenses you mentioned.
if your camera has a focal plane shutter ( like a graflex slr or speed graphic ) you might also look for a 10" tele-optar ( barrel ). they might also fit the bill,
AND because of the tele-design wont use up bellows draw. they also made it in a shutter but they are a little harder to find.

good luck !

Paul Howell · Mar 28, 2016

I have an old Burk and James tessor design that works well, I have been thinking about a Fuji or Nikon, likely which ever I get at the best price. Kodak and Wollensak made 210s as well, both are reasonable good performers, I have a Kodak Commercial Extar 152 mm which is very sharp. There were 600 mm lens available for the Speed, but don't know if there is enough bellows, I seem to recall that the lens needed to be a true tele design or use a lens board with a built out extension.

braxus · Mar 28, 2016

I ended up BIN'ing the Fuji because it seemed to have good lens coatings.

Also would a Yamasaki tele Congo 500mm f/9.5 lens work on my Graflex?

Paul Howell · Mar 28, 2016

If it is a true tele it should, if not need an lens board that is build out to give more reach to the bellows.

braxus · Mar 28, 2016

Paul Howell said:
If it is a true tele it should, if not need an lens board that is build out to give more reach to the bellows.

I don't know if it a true tele or not. It extends quite a bit forward from the lens board on the front, as it is a rather long lens. Would that qualify?

braxus · Mar 28, 2016

braxus said:
I don't know if it a true tele or not. It extends quite a bit forward from the lens board on the front, as it is a rather long lens. Would that qualify?

braxus · Mar 28, 2016

Here above is the lens I'm looking at. Will this work?

MattKing · Mar 28, 2016

This thread might help: http://photo.net/large-format-photography-forum/00340D

Paul Howell · Mar 28, 2016

Seems that lens although a tele design is designed for MF and does not cover a 4X5 well, if your Speed has a interchangle back you could use it with a 6X9 back.

Alan Gales · Mar 28, 2016

How about a Rodenstock Geronar 210mm F/6.8 lens or it's Caltar counterpart? I had the Caltar version and it was so small that it would just fold up inside my Crown Graphic. Lately, I have seen some of these lenses go on Ebay for less than $100 U.S. Dollars. Great for portraiture!

braxus · Mar 28, 2016

Paul Howell said:
Seems that lens although a tele design is designed for MF and does not cover a 4X5 well, if your Speed has a interchangle back you could use it with a 6X9 back.

I found a 400mm Congo from the same manufacturer on Ebay for a little more money. It claims to have coverage for 5x7, so that lens should be okay. I BIN'd it. So now I have 2 lenses coming for my 4x5 camera.

Dan Fromm · Mar 28, 2016

braxus, you should be less rash and wait for advice instead of just buying what you see. APUG is not be best site for advice on large format equipment and technique or on "Graflex" equipment. For better advice in general, go to http://www.largeformatphotography.info/forum/. For better advice on "Graflex" go to www.graflex.org.

You should also be clearer about what you mean by "Graflex." Speed Graphic, Crown Graphic, Super Graphic, all press cameras, or Graflex SLR?

If you have a 4x5 Speed Graphic, you lucked out. A 400 Tele Congo will focus to infinity on one and will allow room for movements. A 500 Tele Congo will also focus to infinity but will be tight on movements. See http://web.archive.org/web/20120419210046/http://www.cosmonet.org/congo/spec_e.htm

If you don't understand what the specs mean, take a cold shower. After you're dry buy a good book on LF photography. Steve Simmons' Understanding the View Camera and Leslie Stroebel's View Camera Technique are both highly recommended, can be bought for not much money via abebooks.com, alibris.com, amazon.com, ...

braxus · Mar 28, 2016

Dan Fromm said:
braxus, you should be less rash and wait for advice instead of just buying what you see. APUG is not be best site for advice on large format equipment and technique or on "Graflex" equipment. For better advice in general, go to http://www.largeformatphotography.info/forum/. For better advice on "Graflex" go to www.graflex.org.

You should also be clearer about what you mean by "Graflex." Speed Graphic, Crown Graphic, Super Graphic, all press cameras, or Graflex SLR?

If you have a 4x5 Speed Graphic, you lucked out. A 400 Tele Congo will focus to infinity on one and will allow room for movements. A 500 Tele Congo will also focus to infinity but will be tight on movements. See http://web.archive.org/web/20120419210046/http://www.cosmonet.org/congo/spec_e.htm

If you don't understand what the specs mean, take a cold shower. After you're dry buy a good book on LF photography. Steve Simmons' Understanding the View Camera and Leslie Stroebel's View Camera Technique are both highly recommended, can be bought for not much money via abebooks.com, alibris.com, amazon.com, ...

Hi Dan,

In between these comments on here I was doing some research on the lenses I was finding on Ebay. The motivating factor on getting the 400mm was the fact it will work with my Speed Graphic and the price was the cheapest option I found. Most other lenses were way up there in price. And the 400mm also was said to have good quality, so that pretty much did it for me. The Fuji I also got had good coatings on it, since many others had flaws and were much older. As for the camera itself, I thought I mentioned what Graflex I had in the initial listing.

Dan Fromm · Mar 28, 2016

braxus said:
Hi Dann,

In between these comments on here I was doing some research on the lenses I was finding on Ebay. The motivating factor on getting the 400mm was the fact it will work with my Speed Graphic and the price was the cheapest option I found. Most other lenses were way up there in price. And the 400mm also was said to have good quality, so that pretty much did it for me. The Fuji I also got had good coatings on it, since many others had flaws and were much older. As for the camera itself, I thought I mentioned what Graflex I had in the initial listing.

I checked all of your posts in this thread before I replied to you. No mention of which camera made by Graflex you have in any of them. Think again.

There was one answer to the second question ("Also is there such a thing as an inexpensive 600mm lens for 4x5?") in your first post. It is off the wall. Ain't no 600 mm lenses that will focus to infinity on a 4x5 Speed Graphic. There are 600 mm lenses that will focus to infinity, closer too, on 4x5 monorails. The problem with using relatively inexpensive long process lenses is timing exposures. To get an idea of what can be done in the way of shutters for them, see http://www.skgrimes.com/lens-mounting/table-of-lenses-fitted-to-shutters

Oh, and by the way, spell my name correctly. I take misspelling it as a direct insult.

shutterfinger · Mar 28, 2016

Dan,
see the 7th post in http://photo.net/large-format-photography-forum/00dr99

braxus · Mar 28, 2016

Dan Fromm said:
I checked all of your posts in this thread before I replied to you. No mention of which camera made by Graflex you have in any of them. Think again.

There was one answer to the second question ("Also is there such a thing as an inexpensive 600mm lens for 4x5?") in your first post. It is off the wall. Ain't no 600 mm lenses that will focus to infinity on a 4x5 Speed Graphic. There are 600 mm lenses that will focus to infinity, closer too, on 4x5 monorails. The problem with using relatively inexpensive long process lenses is timing exposures. To get an idea of what can be done in the way of shutters for them, see http://www.skgrimes.com/lens-mounting/table-of-lenses-fitted-to-shutters

Oh, and by the way, spell my name correctly. I take misspelling it as a direct insult.

Wow Dan,

What has you so hot under the collar? You've been giving me attitude since your first post to me. Misspelling your name was not intentional, but a mistake. Your last name has two Ms and I thought it was your first name with two Ns. I listed the Speed Graphic in the threads title. I don't know how you missed it. I remember you from the Graflex forum and because of the people in there, I chose not to go back. Cool down Dan.

I do my research by asking questions on sites, as well as looking at old posts and other info on the web. I had no idea the Speed Graphic didn't work with 600mm lenses until the issue was pointed out in my research.

Dan Fromm · Mar 28, 2016

Oh, dear. The thread's title is, um, ambiguous. It says that you want to mount a lens that works on a Speed Graphic on a graflex 4x5. Made me scratch my head.

About asking questions on sites. That's one way to get information. Also, unfortunately, misinformation.

Y'r comment about not knowing the Speed Graphic's limits is of a piece with your other posts. You don't know the basics. There's nothing shameful about that. Everyone starts out not knowing the basics. They're better learned from books than from random replies, some silly, on bulletin boards like this one. That's why I suggested you buy a book and even named a few.

Charles, I saw it. Straight from the manufacturer is better. That's why I posted a link to an archived version of Yamasaki's site. The company's out of business and the site has vanished.

removed account4 · Mar 28, 2016

it's not as long as you would like but a 15" tele optar comes in a barrel and can be found in a shutter.
it is like the 10" nice wide open, sharp stopped down, and works perfectly on a speed graphic.

braxus · Mar 28, 2016

Thank you for your last post Dan. Much better. I haven't used my Speed Graphic for many years, but want to get using it again. I have forgotten a lot about the camera. Took me a short while to remember how to open the thing today. I have numerous boxes of film in my freezer I need to get using. I only really had the one good lens on the Graflex and it was a wide angle. Very limiting. Since I have some funds coming up fairly soon, I decided its time to get the remaining 2 lenses I need for the 4x5 to get using it again. I had a second lens for it from before, but it was a bastard child lens that wasn't really usable. I'm getting rid of it as we speak.

Kyle M. · Mar 30, 2016

If you end up not being happy with the 400mm Congo you may wanna take a look at the Wollensak Raptar 15" f5.6 telephoto. I wasn't in the market for a long lens for 4x5 but was just browsing evil bay a couple weeks ago and came across one in a Alphax #4 shutter at a good price. I ended up mounting it on my Arca Swiss 4x5 and so far I'm pretty impressed with it, it's really sharp stopped down and I'm even impressed with it wide open. It takes about 10" of bellows to focus at infinity and with the 16" rail on my Arca Swiss I can get down to about 6'. I believe the Crown/Speed graphics have 12.5" of bellows extension so not sure how close you could get.

Also while only having a top speed of 1/50 sec. the Alphax shutter is self cocking, so thats one less thing you have to remember to do. I can't say for sure but I think you could mount it in a graflex board with the shutter, the Alphax #4 needs a hole approximately 2.618" in diameter. I used a 2-/8" hole saw to drill the board and have mine on a Linhof Technika board. While the shutter nearly covers the board it works out just fine.

Sirius Glass · Mar 30, 2016

I use a Schneider-Kreuznach Symmar-S f/5.6 210mm lens on my Pacemaker Speed Graphic.

jimjm · Mar 30, 2016

Have you considered a 203/7.7 Kodak Ektar lens? Since you're looking for lenses of similar length, this one is small, light and very sharp. Comparable to modern lenses and will cover up to 5x7.

You should be able to find one with shutter for about $200.

Ian Grant · Mar 30, 2016

jimjm said:
Have you considered a 203/7.7 Kodak Ektar lens? Since you're looking for lenses of similar length, this one is small, light and very sharp. Comparable to modern lenses and will cover up to 5x7.

You should be able to find one with shutter for about $200.

If you buy a British made Kodak Ltd Mount 370 203mm f7.7 Ektar you can find one in a Compur #0 or earlier in a Prontor #0 try and avoid the Kodak Epsilon. Very late EK (US) versions were in a Compur #2 but seem to be quite rare (I have one),

I have a 210mm f5.6 Symmar S it's usually on my Wista but I have used it on my Crown and Super Graphics but prefer the 203mm Ektar when carrying a light weight kit as the Symmar is quite large and heavy. The other advantage of the 203mm Ektar is it's excellent from Infinity right through to close distances up to 1:1, Kodak sold it for scientific and medical work in the UK as the standard lens on their Half Plate camera.

Ian

210mm Lens for Speed Graphic on Graflex 4x5

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