120 film frame for the Fuji SFA238 optical film mililab

Looking to buy 120 manual film carrier/frame for the old optical minilab Fuji SFA238.

We have decided to add such a bonus for people to come and print their 4x5 photos optically from their c41 films themselves in our lab. Looks like people like the idea but now they ask for 120 film option also.

If somebody has one, please contact me.

Serg Lavrenchuk said:

...people to come and print their 4x5 photos optically from their c41 films themselves in our lab.

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The customer himself operating a minilab machine?

Yes, under our supervision (in the room where we meet clients we put an optical machine). If client want we print, if he whant to be a part of the process - we show him what to push and then just change the same price for the quantity of 4x5 done.

That is our new experiment. Would see what if would look like after some time. Maybe we change our mind

The price of the machine was not much + service + pick up = about 400 usd. So risks are mostly in the impossibility to find out spare parts when something would be damaged.

Hi,
As well as the carrier you may have to change the lens as well ......do you have the manual, it normally lists what lens set will work with each carrier.

When I was working for Fuji film as a Tech in the 90’s none of the customers bought the 120 kit, SFA238 labs that did not print 120 they just sent it out to one of the pro labs. The amount of 120 film compared to 35mm was small.

Have you tried contacting Fuji film to see if the have any old stock?

Johnkpap

IIRC the 238 will print 6x4.5 without a need to change the lens.
I had a 238 for a couple of years before changing to a Frontier and I think we used the 6x4.5 carrier and lightbox once or twice in the 3 years we had it.
Besides parts, check for the availability of the printing lamp.
Best of luck with your experiment and I hope it is a success. I think customers will love the idea of using a lab printer to make prints fron their negs.
Let us know how you get on.

I do not know a single photographer in person who still uses 4x5 format, let alone would have them printed (resp. print himself) in minilab.

Serg, you must have quite some of them in your draw area to even consider this.

Johnkpap said:

Hi,
As well as the carrier you may have to change the lens as well ......do you have the manual, it normally lists what lens set will work with each carrier.
Johnkpap

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Yep. I got a nice and green big book. I saw that I would need a lens also but somehow thought that the lens would be easier to find (i heard from people that their used Rodagons fix lenses with 120 film).
Am I too optimistic about that?
Will try to find out tomorrow + I think service guy would come tomorrow again. Our 135 frame has all rubber rollers decayed so I was trying to find a substitute.
Another service guy gave me rollers from old Fuji SP film scanner (to try them with our decayed Noritsu 1800 rollers) and they magically fit SFA's nc135j film carrier.

Johnkpap said:

When I was working for Fuji film as a Tech in the 90’s none of the customers bought the 120 kit, SFA238 labs that did not print 120 they just sent it out to one of the pro labs. The amount of 120 film compared to 35mm was small.
Johnkpap

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The same story in Ukraine. A lot of these machines were operating or ended their long migration path in Ukraine but non with 120 film option.
I have found traces of one SFA that had 120 carriers but it was resold and is not in operation any more (and contacts of the last user are lost also).
And there is another 238 machine that is still in operation here in Kyiv with 120 carriers in another lab.

Johnkpap said:

Have you tried contacting Fuji film to see if the have any old stock?
Johnkpap

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I do not know how to do that.
I have tried a few times to contact them through local reseller about different technical questions about their CA / dp2 papers, CPRA chemistry and other.
And it always was one-way communication. So I would like to find a way to contact them directly somehow (if you have any contacts could you advice in PM).


ps What was very touching is the visual and inside shape of the machine. The machine was owned and operated with one guy in the village for some 10 years (with last 4 standing stopped in his kitchen).
And that is the first time I see the machine that was so lovely looked after. Everything is clean. Plastic even not yellow as all old Fuji machines I saw.
Every stainless steel screw of the casing is present (every guy who operated machines heavy I hope to understand my joy - when you lose a screw and the are still some to keep casing in place - you just go on).

And this village guy told me "remember, you must take crossover racks every day off, wash and keep in a tray till the next day".
Every piece of equipment I saw here had such stalactites that I could just draw stories in my mind how managed to raise that. This SFA was a real gem in our country labs reality.

Johnkpap said:

When I was working for Fuji film as a Tech in the 90’s none of the customers bought the 120 kit, SFA238 labs that did not print 120 they just sent it out to one of the pro labs. The amount of 120 film compared to 35mm was small.
Johnkpap

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John, could you tell from your experience was that such a problem with Fuji SFA zoom lenses - them all of them at last end up with zoom jam due to wear between the friction rings?
One serviceman was advising against this model due to this problem with lenses and no spare ones any more.

Fuji is the worst manufacturer to contact, you must be prepared to receive even an insulting reply on a request as Serg made

foc said:

IIRC the 238 will print 6x4.5 without a need to change the lens.
I had a 238 for a couple of years before changing to a Frontier and I think we used the 6x4.5 carrier and lightbox once or twice in the 3 years we had it.

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What is funny - I have a light mixing box and a guy got and gave with machine a 4-eyed lens to make optical document photos (4 photos on one 4x5 paper from one 35 neg).
It made me so nostalgic that I think I would make an "open door document-photo day" for customers to come on with their cameras and friends and make their own document photos

As It seems to me that 4-eye lens needed 6x6 mixing box.

foc said:

IIRC the 238 will print 6x4.5 without a need to change the lens.
Besides parts, check for the availability of the printing lamp.

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Yep. That was my first idea when I saw the lamp. As this one looked not like something that could be substituted by Osram.
I have 1 in the machine, one new and one used!? ... (that all from words).

How long does it last usually - the lamp? In exposures in years of use?

foc said:

Best of luck with your experiment and I hope it is a success. I think customers will love the idea of using a lab printer to make prints fron their negs.
Let us know how you get on.

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Even if we would see that our idea was too maximalist our customers ask for the possibility to order 8x10 optical prints from their neg for less that 7.5eur minimum that we charge for the same ra4 print done on the enlarger.
A lot of young people (and not young) trying to take pictures with film (3/4 due to fashion and 1/4 to see a different picture or enjoy being involved in the process).

And most of these young people can't afford shooting Portra. They ask for the cheapest 3+ eur Color Plus film and order processing and inexpensive Noritsu scan.

One 8*10 print for 7.5 is prohibitively expensive for them (as it is the price for one roll of Portra). As a lab we also can't go smaller than 8x10 with enlarger (and so less expensive).

Having an optical lab printer gives the possibility for youngsters to try optical prints from their negs in 4x5 paper size for some psychological 0.2eur. The thing we would like to do for them but couldn't afford.

AgX said:

I do not know a single photographer in person who still uses 4x5 format, let alone would have them printed (resp. print himself) in minilab.
Serg, you must have quite some of them in your draw area to even consider this.

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We have. Maybe cause we are in biggest city of the country here. To tell the truth, I would love myself to have this option to print big "contacts" but looks like this time I would not be the one to get bonuses.
Last time I mostly use XPan and this Fuji wouldn't rid me off the necessity of printing small prints with glass mask.

If I would be so happy to find the 120 film carrier maybe I would custom order insert for XPan for it

From the point of chemistry stability - yes, maybe we would propose few free prints from each scanned film just to have minimum chemistry throughput for the next few months.
Also this way we plan to let some people to pick up their films. It might sound even weirder than is it but a lot of people do not come to take their films now. Their order processing and scanning and then forget about the film or ask to destroy it.

AgX said:

Fuji is the worst manufacturer to contact, you must be prepared to receive even an insulting reply on a request as Serg made

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Unless you had 10 years experience with durst-pro-usa )))

Hi Serg
I am happy to see that I have been of some technical help, it was along time ago when I worked for Fuji/Hanimex here in Australia, in my time I installed and repaired a number of SFA 238 machines, they once setup were very reliable and very easy to repair (Frontier's are not as easy) :- From my Experience the zoom lenses didn't give any problems, the only zoom lens issue i saw was one that went out of alignment due to a grub screw working its way loose, I managed to do a alignment as per the manual and replaced the grub-screw the lens was fine after that. It would take a very long time to wear out a zoom lens, if your machine is in well cared for condition I would not worry too much.

Lamps :-The number of hours you will get from them is stated in the manual and is correct, also check the lamp every week if the reflector/ globe starts to go black it is time for a new one or the print quality will start to suffer.

Try contacting Fuji film in Japan, the USA or UK you might get a better response

One of the labs I use to service had a D-Carrier they could scan the 120 film and then send it to the D-carrier to make 120 film prints, I know that is not optical but it is a option

Regards

Johnkpap

Could somebody advice what densitometric standard Fuji used in their densitometers for minilabs. Especially SFA238?

I wish to check the densitometer with I1 in the densitometric mode. There are ANSI A/T and DIN / DIN NB standards.
None of which is proportional to my minilab densitometer readings.

Thanks in advance.