120 film explanation please

Pomgonewalkabout · Oct 3, 2008

Dear forum,
In a past life I used to develop my own 35mm black and white film, but I don't know much about 120.

I recently purchased a few old film cameras off ebay, including for nostalgic reasons a Praktica MTL5, A yashica Electro and today a Agfa Isoly 1 which shoots 120 film.

What I don't understand is the paper backing, with 120 film.
I'm curious as to what you do with the paper backing should I wish to develop my own film down the track.

Does it separate from the film as you load it into the reels of the developing tank?

cheers Eric

arigram · Oct 3, 2008

The paper backing sticks at the end of the film. You peel it off when you load it in the reels.
Then you either stick the sticker to itself or cut it off.
You can discard it along with the plastic 120 reel. I keep the "bones" myself.
Be careful not to load the paper in the reel instead of the film! It happens to all at least once.
By feel, film is a bit thicker and harder than the paper.
One thing to be aware of, is that 120 is lot more sensitive to light than the hermetically closed 135 and you should avoid exposing the roll in direct strong light, such as the sun. Take it out from the foil and load it in the camera in the shade (even of your own body) and when exposed, take it out and keep it somewhere protected from strong light, like a bag or box.

AgX · Oct 3, 2008

The idea behing the backing paper is (next to protecting the film in the spooled stage from light) to provide the user with information as to how far advance the film for preparing for the next exposure. By means of a red filter (early films were red-insensitive) in the back of the camera one could see markings printed on that paper. With the advance of roll-film cameras with frame counter or even controlled film transport the type 120 got technically obsolete, however is still the most common spooled film for that width...

Another type, type 220, uses paper only as leading and ending strips to protect the spooled film from light. The decrease in thickness/dsiameter is used to insert twice the film length.

Meanwhile a third type, type 320, has been proposed.

Steve Smith · Oct 3, 2008

arigram said:
Then you either stick the sticker to itself or cut it off.

Or if you are feeling adventurous, use it to join to another film and get two 120 films onto the same reel.

Steve.

cdholden · Oct 3, 2008

Eric,
Follow the lead of your fellow ape huggers. JBrunner, of APUG fame/infamy, has done a 4 segment tutorial on how to develop 120 film.
You can find the first part, then link to the others from here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6P9bNcBE_Hc.
It can be of help to the first timer, but personally, I think it needs bacon.
Chris

dancqu · Oct 3, 2008

The main purpose of the paper backing is the
pulling of the film to first frame and each
following frame. Dan

SuzanneR · Oct 3, 2008

Or sacrifice a roll to the film gods... run it through the camera, not making any important exposures, then open it up, and see how it looks, and how it is attached to the paper backing. You'll have a very clear understanding of how it's manufactured, and a roll of "practice" film for the reels is always handy!

Thomas Bertilsson · Oct 3, 2008

What Suzanne said. And watch JBrunner's videos, like suggested above.

The paper backing lies loose against the film, except for in one place, at the beginning of the film, where the film and paper are taped together. You remove this paper entirely when you develop the film.

The paper protects the film while it's on the spool so it doesn't get exposed to light. It also helps you understand what frame you are winding the film to, or what frame you are currently exposing. At least that was the idea once, when there was a window on the camera back where you can actually view the film advancement. Modern cameras will keep track of the frame number for you, so the need for the paper backing covering the whole length of the film has been eliminated, but the 120 format persists, which is good for those like you and me that like to use older cameras. Newer toy cameras, like the Holga, or pinhole cameras, like the ZeroImage, have the old style window to view the frame number through as well.

I hope that helps.

- Thomas

mikebarger · Oct 3, 2008

I just fold the tape over onto the film after removing the paper. It provides a little stiffness to the film when your sticking it under the clip on 120 stainlesss reels.

Mike

vdonovan · Oct 3, 2008

Welcome to the world of 120! It is a very rewarding format. I find the big film more enjoyable to work with for shooting, processing and printing. And of course the results can be stunning. I've pretty much stopped shooting 35mm since I got my Medium Format gear.

A caveat: loading 220 (which is double-length 120 without the paper backing) is a nightmare until you've had some practice. Stick with 120 for a while.

dpurdy · Oct 3, 2008

I tear the tape off the paper and leave it on the film for processing. I have never had a problem from this.

I go to the trouble of seperating the paper from the used plastic spools and then recycling the paper but now I have a mountain of plastic spools with no way to re use or recycle.

haris · Oct 3, 2008

I peel off tape from film too. I allways thought glue and else from tape can contaminate chemistry...

TheDreadPirateRobins · Oct 3, 2008

As I learned when I once accidentally opened up my TLR (thinking it was empty), some kinds of 120 film, at least, are held to their paper backing by a piece of masking tape near one end of the roll.

dpurdy · Oct 3, 2008

haris said:
I peel off tape from film too. I allways thought glue and else from tape can contaminate chemistry...

I was worried about that too since I use a large tank of developer and don't change it till I have done 150 rolls of film. I imagined bits of tape stuck to my film. But one day I had a bad finger and thumb so I just started tearing the tape away and it was so quick and easy that I stuck with it now through many batches of developer and I have never seen any problem from it at all. I think perhaps the manufacturers gave that some thought in their tape selection. Especially Acros is plastic tape.. no fibers. For me, no more pealing that tape and wishing I had better fingernails.
DP

michaelbsc · Oct 3, 2008

Steve Smith said:
Or if you are feeling adventurous, use it to join to another film and get two 120 films onto the same reel.

Steve.

I keep thinking about doing this. How well does it work, really?

Thomas Bertilsson · Oct 3, 2008

Works just fine. Make sure you have enough developer in the tank, though. As in enough concentrate per film, as you have twice the film surface area to develop.

- Thomas

michaelbsc said:
I keep thinking about doing this. How well does it work, really?

michaelbsc · Oct 3, 2008

Thomas Bertilsson said:
Works just fine. Make sure you have enough developer in the tank, though. As in enough concentrate per film, as you have twice the film surface area to develop.

- Thomas

Well, I admit that I have already taken two strips of developed and dry film and loaded them back onto a reel in the daylight just to make sure I could get it to work. They do fit, obviously. I use plain old Paterson plastic reels. I just haven't tried it in the dark yet.

Thanks for the warning about the amount of concentrate. I think my normal one-shot dilution is enough, but I will make sure. I normally use DD-X at 1+5 (instead of 1+4). Because my ambient temperature is a little high I control at 75f (24C) instead of 68F, and using 1+5 gives me just a little more time in the soup to make sure things are even.

MB

Pomgonewalkabout · Oct 3, 2008

Thanks for all the replies, sure is a load of information.
I will get a small kit together and give it a go.

cheers Eric

pentaxuser · Oct 3, 2008

Pomgonewalkabout said:
Dear forum,
Itoday a Agfa Isoly 1 which shoots 120 film.

cheers Eric

If you have used the Agfa Isolette 1 already then just ignore this post but if not then two tips about winding the film on to each successive frame.

1 Covering the red window there should be an aluminium slide which can be pushed up to cover the window giving you double protection. I'd use it at all times except when winding on. I suspect that old red windows like old red safelights can deteriorate and not be as light safe as when new.
2. Look for the frame numbers on the backing paper by shading the window. They can be difficult to see through the window in full sunlight and anyway while winding you have to risk the window providing full protection so bright sunlight on the window isn't a good idea.

Have fun

pentaxuser

Ross Chambers · Oct 4, 2008

And if you peel the tape off quite briskly in the darkroom prior to loading into the spiral you can sometimes produce an exciting flash of light. The bets are not yet off as to whether this can fog, but I don't take the gamble. I do like the added stiffness when loading steel spirals too, but it's beside the point with Paterson ones.

Regards - Ross

Iwagoshi · Oct 4, 2008

SuzanneR said:
Or sacrifice a roll to the film gods... run it through the camera, not making any important exposures, then open it up, and see how it looks, and how it is attached to the paper backing. You'll have a very clear understanding of how it's manufactured, and a roll of "practice" film for the reels is always handy!

Suzanne, that is similar to what I did. I had not used 120/220 before so I took apart a roll of expired EPY, just to see how it worked, didn't run it through the camera, just untaped and unwound it. As a kid I did the same thing to watches.

Terry

srs5694 · Oct 5, 2008

One point about 120 film is that it's taped to the backing paper on only one end of the roll -- the start of the roll (as in, the part nearest the first frame you shoot). Thus, if you sacrifice an unexposed roll, fresh from the box, for loading experiments, you'll encounter the taped end first. If you run a roll through a camera, or simulate this by sacrificing the roll by rolling it onto an empty spool in any other way, then when you go to load the tank, you'll encounter no tape until the end of the roll.

120 film explanation please

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