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Discussion in 'B&W: Film, Paper, Chemistry' started by MattKing, Dec 3, 2005.
Here is an an e-bay auction for the traditionalists here:
Paper from the 1960s
you gotta think this stuff might be good for a display but not for actual use in the darkroom. I would think this stuff is fogged beyond all hope. I did not think it was too great a paper in 1966 either.
Dang, Lee, I grew up printing on Medalist ...
I have a print on Medalist from Claire Senft from one of the print exchanges. Seems like good stuff if you've got an affinity for it.
Anyone for Opal? Platino? Velour Black? I used to like Opal. Recently I have seen some old prints made on it, and the newer materials are really better.
For what it's worth,
There was nothing wrong with Medalist papers, it printed very well, I did not like the color/tone of the finished print when developed in Dektol. The finished print had a somewhat warm brown black tone rather than cold black.
Dupont Velour Black was my favorite simply because of the finished tone cold black. I would estimate I used well over 25000 sheets of 8x10 Medalist f2 and f3, and 45 to 50000 sheets of Dupont in 2 & 3 grade. I also used a lot of Agfa and Gavaert paper and films. Though warmer than Dupont they all printed beautifully.
I wouldent be interested in any of the paper this guys has to sell, as Lee said I'll bet they near worthless for printing purposes.
I usually purchased in 500 to 1000 sheets packed in 250 sheet boxes of the same batch/emulsion numbers, so once I was zeroed in on it and managed to controll negative exposure and development I was set for some time.
Again, my opinion based on a whole lot of years printing with the above papers. Charlie.............
Is medalist paper a contact paper, and anything like AZO?
Medalist was a neutral-to-warm chlorobromide enlarging paper. I personally loved it, as it seemed to be fairly silver-rich, and had good exposure and development latitude. AZO is a straight silver chloride, contact printing paper. Anyway, they're both relics of the past now. And some current papers outperform the old ones in some ways. It was/ is a matter of taste.
Some would say everything here (APUG) is "relics of the past" certainly AZO is still kicking. I read an interesting article in View Camera - it appears sales of 8x10 cameras is quite good these days. I haven't seen any drop in prices on e-bay. I think the test of relic vs relevent is to see if the process is generally considered desirable for art. AZO is a premium for that. Holga and pinhole are. ALT Processes are alive and well. ULF and LF are in the highest regard for artists in this group. ..... Now I do have this old 1 Megapixel camera ... It is a relic, heck - It has to be 4 years old!
All I meant is that you can't get Medalist, almost can't get Azo now. Sure, it would be great to find some Velour Black and play with it. How about Dassonville Black? They're all gone. We'll all look back on the good old days when we could get Oriental Seagull. Paper manufacturers come and go. Photographers survive the changes -- it's not the materials that count, it's the vision and skill of the artist.
A couple of years ago I drove over to the bay area to pick up an EBAY treasure that was really too much bother to ship. It was a complete 8X10 C-1 outfit with all the original receipts including my Ries tripod which is the one piece I was after. Anyways there was a 500 sheet box of 8X10 Gevaert Contactone paper. Not Agfa / Gevaert, just Gevaert which meant it was pre-1964. A couple of months went by and I was going through the stuff and I almost threw that box out. Then I surmised "contactone" hmmm this stuff must be Chloride like AZO. So I tore a sheet in half, put half in Dektol and the other half in fix. After 4 minutes or so I fixed the Dektol portion and compared. No fog. AT ALL! Tore another sheet in half and stuck a 4X5 neg on it and flicked on the darkroom lights for about 3 1/2 minutes. Gorgeous print. So I'm happily using the last box of Gevaert Contactone on earth and loving it. It's warmer than AZO. It's a lovely paper and how I wish Agfa or somebody would revive it.
There is a good chance the paper is not fogged. I inherited some Ektalure and Medalist with expiration dates late 1960`s. It prints without fog.
Also got some Polycontrast F single wt that is fine.
Modern papers have chemicals in them so they need not be aged before sale if I can believe what I read on www.Defenderphoto. I must agree the latest papers from Kodak and Ilford have a short shelf life for whatever the reason. Ilford even hides the expiration date so the consumer can`t read it. They will furnish it if you call, but can you imagine calling from a store to get an expiration date? Note they don`t work weekends when you are at the store.
Cold storage will NOT improve the shelf life significantly for this type of paper.
E mail Ilford and express your dissatisfaction with hidden dates. Kodak already threw in the towel.
fhovie - I'm not sure that Azo is still kicking. I'm sure I read that Kodak sold off the last of it and even Michael & Paula can't get anymore, and have stopped selling what they have in stock. I might be wrong though...
M&P are still going to sell some of the remaining stock of grade 2 Azo, but not grade 3.
I have a stash of Kodabromide in several grades and finishes; it's from 1982 and prints fine. Also 15 year old Oriental and 11 boxes of Portiga but I can't date it.
No problem with any printing...
Like everyone else, I used a lot of medalist paper back in the 50s and 60s. I was not all that impressed, but it was reliable and serviceable. Ektalure came later. Ektalure was, IMO, an outstanding paper. It looked good right from the wash (if maybe a little green at times), and it toned beautifully. It was also available in a variety of surfaces, and you could use the surface that fit the mood of the print. It was also about the only fiber based paper I've seen more or less recently (it only went away 10-15 years ago) that dried flat. It dried perfectly. Does anyone know of anything like it today?
"... where there is a will, there is a dead person ... " or something like that. It appears there is a alternative to AZO that will be soon available from Michael and Paula that might even be b*e*t*t*e*r than AZO. I have faith! the digi-weenies will not take over the whole planet. Besides, I have not seen much digital printing of photographs show up as collectable fine art yet. Seems Silver Chloride is still king whrere the money is in art.