Scanning negs to make prints

[bluedog]

I have been scanning 35mm and MF negatives to get prints of around 8 x 10 size. I currently scan at 2400dpi. The MF scans seem to come out much better than the 35mm but prints still look overly grainy - not sure if this is due to the film, scanning or combination of both. Should I be scanning at a higher resolution for prints and higher resolution for 35mm? I use an Epson v500 and get the prints done at a pro lab.

 

[cupcake_ham]

What sharpening are you applying in post processing? Are you applying any sharpening in the scanning stage?

 

[pellicle]

Hi

I'm having trouble with your question ...

I have been scanning 35mm and MF negatives to get prints of around 8 x 10 size.

ok ...

I currently scan at 2400dpi.

for everything?

what size format in MF?? like 645, 6x6 6x9??

assuming you're scanning 6x7 MF then 2400dpi is enough for a 22inch print @ 300dpi output

anyway, 2400dpi is nearly right on for a 11inch print from your 35mm

The MF scans seem to come out much better than the 35mm

to be expected ... as you are getting way more pixels from it and probably not comparing a 100mm lens on both images

but prints still look overly grainy - not sure if this is due to the film, scanning or combination of both.

which prints? The MF prints, the 35mm prints ... both?

Should I be scanning at a higher resolution for prints and higher resolution for 35mm?

now I'm lost ... could you re-express this?

I use an Epson v500 and get the prints done at a pro lab.

ok ... know what they're using to print?

anyway the point above about sharpening is a good one, and important too

 

[bluedog]

Scanning both 35mm and 6x7 MF at 2400dpi. I'm not applying any sharpening.
The MF prints look grainy mainly in the skies. I think they use a Fuji Frontier machine for printing at the lab.
Sounds like I should try the sharpening tool. The last point on resolution was referring to whether I should scan 35 mm at say 4800dpi or higher.

 

[pellicle]

Hi

Scanning both 35mm and 6x7 MF at 2400dpi. I'm not applying any sharpening.
The MF prints look grainy mainly in the skies. I think they use a Fuji Frontier machine for printing at the lab.
Sounds like I should try the sharpening tool. The last point on resolution was referring to whether I should scan 35 mm at say 4800dpi or higher.

Ok ... skies are grainy ... sounds like scanning technique. Are you scanning neg as neg or positive and inverting? I suggest you try my technique http://cjeastwd.blogspot.com/2009/10/quick-negative-scan-tutorial.html. This is described using a Nikon, but the same applies for Epson ... I suggest this page as a stepping stone to other blog posts on the issue

also, sharpening will only make your gain worse. Sky grain is most likely to be a result of noise in the blue channel. Using <myPersonalOpinion>that crap piece of software</myPersonalOpinion>ColourNeg (or NegPos or whatever it is named now) will only give you worse results in this respect.

So your MF looks grainer than your 35mm? This sounds like it could be getting made worse by their / your down-sampling technique.

I suggest you send them files which are sized exactly right for the print you want

 

[TareqPhoto]

Nice thread, i am so new on film, and just yesterday i've got my developed MF color film [E100G 120] from lab yesterday, i really don't know how to scan but i tried and got acceptable result, i can say it is perfect or amazing but i am sure maybe it is not and needs a lot of work, but because i am so new on film i really don't know what scanning settings i should do when scanning the film neg, i have Epson V750.
I posted one frame results[scan] as a post on someone thread here.

 

[bmwolf]

I don't post here much(or at all) but I browse often. Having owned a v500 in the past, I think I can offer some advice.

The V500 likely doesn't have more "real" resolution than 2000SPI. In fact, I found that mine started to get artifacts at anything above 1600-1800SPI. Scanning at a higher res than this will not make the scans better, only give you larger files. You can prove this by making one scan at 2400 and another at 1800. Enlarge the 1800 SPI file to 2400 in photoshop and then compare the two. There should be little to no difference between them, but you may find the lower resolution file is actually sharper!

8x10 from medium format should not be a problem, but from 35mm it's a pretty large enlargement(>8x). As much as you probably don't want to hear it, i'm gonna come across like a scanner snob and say you may want to look into a more capable scanner. I think the v500 is adequate for web res scans, but really falls short for prints. I had a Coolscan before my v500 and the v500 was a huuuuge step down in quality.

Something like a Coolscan 9000 might be more than you'd like to spend, so there are some steps you can take to make sure your scans are as good as they can be. If you want to have a decently clean 2400SPI file, scan at 3600-4800 SPI and downsample the scan to 1800(or 2400) in Photoshop using bicubic. This will reduce scanner noise, particularly with slides. You said negatives, so the effect may not be as noticeable, but it should still help.

Your scans are also gonna need sharpening; my scans from the Epson were very very soft. Only problem, as others said, is that this can make the noise/grain even worse. I'd do some noise reduction to the full res file(3600-4800SPI), then do some high-pass sharpening and then downsample using bicubic, as mentioned above.

I don't remember you saying what film you shoot, but you did mention that the skies are grainy. To reiterate what pellicle said, all the negative film I scan has much grainier blue then all the other colors. If you use Photoshop you can look at the blue channel and see it is noisier/grainier than the rest of the channels. You may want to run some noise reduction on that channel or create a mask and put a small Gaussian blur in areas of smooth light blue tonality(i.e. skies).

The lab may be adding their own sharpening too, and their downsizing may not be that good. I agree with pellicle, you should resize the files yourself before sending them and make sure they aren't doing anything to the files.