Old Jobo Tetanol C-41 Press Kit - spoiled?

[SkipA]

I've had a Jobo Tetenol C-41 Press Kit, 1 liter, powdered, that is many years old. I am not sure when I bought it, but probably back in 2003 or so. When I opened the developer packet, I noticed a lot of brown flecks in the powder. When I mixed it with 800ml water as directed, it turned out a somewhat turbid dark amber, almost brown color.

I'm guessing the developer is spoiled, oxidized, even though it was in a sealed foil pouch. Surely the developer shouldn't be brown. But I've never used one of these press kits before, so I figured I'd ask.

Can anyone confirm?

 

[SkipA]

After sitting a bit, the turbidity has disappeared. It is now clear, but it has the color of dark apple juice.

 

[SkipA]

I developed two rolls of 120 Fuji NPS 160, and one roll each 35mm Kodak Portra 160 VC, Supra 100, and Ektar 100. The negs all look good.

 

[Sirius Glass]

I am going to go out on an limb and say that your old Jobo Tetanol C-41 Press Kit has not spoiled.

Steve

 

[SkipA]

Based on my results, I'd have to agree. But the proof will be in the printing. Even so, I am not going to push this kit beyond its recommended capacity, just in case that dark colored developer is a sign of aging. Now, time to order some RA-4 chemicals.


I processed this film using 1500 series drums in my Jobo CPP-2 using the Hewes-made Jobo stainless steel reels. I've had the SS reels and cores for years, but this was my first time to use them. I'd always used the plastic reels in the past. The SS reels are a pleasure to use.

 

[tbeaman]

You sure that's darker than normal? You're talking dark apple juice here and I usually refer to mine as looking like iced tea (when freshly mixed). Sounds the same to me, but these are hardly scientific descriptions, haha.

 

[hpulley]

C-41 chems aside from stabilizer are not clear like B&W chemicals. The developer should be dark like iced tea and the blix should be darker like prune juice. When you can't tell them apart it is time to mix up a new batch I run 25 rolls per 1L of JOBO Press Kit but I test clip after 12-16 rolls to make sure it isn't dead because it dies quickly when it dies in my experience.

Powder lasts almost forever unless the packages leak and oxidize. I just mixed up some old Microphen 600mL which comes with development times for FP4 and HP5 (before the plus versions). It worked great on Delta 3200! Of course I clip tested first. Those films were discontinued in 1990 so the powder must be at least 20 years old...

 

[SkipA]

You sure that's darker than normal? You're talking dark apple juice here and I usually refer to mine as looking like iced tea (when freshly mixed). Sounds the same to me, but these are hardly scientific descriptions, haha.

C-41 chems aside from stabilizer are not clear like B&W chemicals. The developer should be dark like iced tea and the blix should be darker like prune juice. When you can't tell them apart it is time to mix up a new batch I run 25 rolls per 1L of JOBO Press Kit but I test clip after 12-16 rolls to make sure it isn't dead because it dies quickly when it dies in my experience.

Powder lasts almost forever unless the packages leak and oxidize. I just mixed up some old Microphen 600mL which comes with development times for FP4 and HP5 (before the plus versions). It worked great on Delta 3200! Of course I clip tested first. Those films were discontinued in 1990 so the powder must be at least 20 years old...

Thanks for the comments, guys. It didn't occur to me to compare the color of the developer to iced tea because the way I brew my tea it comes out nearly as dark as cola. That's why I said dark apple juice. It was the only thing that occurred to me. But the comparison to ice tea is appropriate if I think of what I'm served in a restaurant.

I'll have a couple more rolls to run through this batch of chemicals this weekend. And now I'm on the hunt (perhaps Fuji Hunt) for RA-4 chemicals. It's rather tedious to source some of these chemicals.

 

[hpulley]

I use Kodak Ektacolor RA RT for prints since I can get the 10L size by mail.

 

[Bob-D659]

SkipA, 127.0.0.1 is not a location.

if you are in Canada or the lower 48 states in the US, Kodak RA4 10 liter kits are as near as your computer, adorama.com in the US, Photocentral.ca in Canada. For Photocentral, you might have to send an email, I don't see it on their new website, but dev and blix kits are normally stocked items.

 

[SkipA]

Hey there Bob. 127.0.0.1 is a location in Texas. OK, well, it's one of those universal locations that exist everywhere. You know, there's no place like home(node), or localhost, as the case may be.

Yes, I can easily order from Adorama, and there might even be a camera store or two in Dallas I can buy chemicals from. The problem is knowing what to get. I haven't done any RA-4 printing in about 6 years. The last time I did it, there were Kodak 5 liter kits avaialble that had everything in them. Now it appears that the kits are gone and I have to buy the individual concentrates. I'm not sure what I need.

Bob, hpulley, Will I need anything besides this?

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Do I need this?

Kodak Ektacolor RA Paper Developer Starter, 25 Gallons (gee I hope that's a concentrate that makes 25 gallons, should be enough for a lifetime?)

I'll be processing prints in a Fujimoto CP-31 that has a replenisher unit. Do I need the Dead Link Removed too?

 

[hpulley]

Yes, for whatever reason DarkroomCentral.ca's website consolodation to PhotoCentral.ca has dropped it from the catalog but I emailed them and they still carry it! Send them an email and they'll set you up which is good, I thought I'd lost my source...

Otherwise there is a 5L Tetenal kit that B&H will ship here. It is more than the Kodak 10L kit so I haven't tried it yet but if I have to, I will give it a try.

 

[SkipA]

Ordering from a store in Canada is probably not the quickest or most cost-effective way to get chemicals in Texas. I'm going to call a couple of local camera stores that still sell darkroom supplies to see if they have the stuff I need locally. Once I determine exactly what it is I need, that is.

I hope all my old paper is still usable.

 

[Bob-D659]

I don't have to email PhotoCentral, they are just a 15 min drive downtown for me.

Yes it's similar to 192.168.0.1 or 10.0.0.1 BTDT, been an IT guy for 30 years.

You will need the starter, and it will last a lifetime or three.

The blix additive is to lengthen the life with low utilization, optional if you want.

All depends on how many prints you are doing and the tank sizes in your processor.

I just do room temp in drums, so more work, but chemical usage is very low.

 

[Bob-D659]

Well if you are close to Austin, I could be persuaded to deliver them next time I go down there to visit my son, once the heatwave is done for the year.

Much easier to pay Adorama to ship them. Most dealers and minilab suppliers can get the same, but Kodak pack four kits to a carton. PhotoCentral and Adorama breakup the factory packaging for retail sales.

 

[SkipA]

Hey, another old IT guy! No offense intended Bob; it's been 30 plus years in IT for me too. Oddly, I still find it more or less satisfying work.

Thank you for the confirmation on the starter.

The CP-31 has 2 or 2.5 liter tanks, I believe. I haven't seen it yet. I just bought it and it'll be a week at least before it arrives. My utilization will be low, I'm sure, so the blix additive may be worthwhile.

Dallas is not far from Austin, about 195 miles or 3.5 hours. I appreciate your offer to bring some down, but the heat wave isn't going to be over anytime soon, I'm afraid. I'll order from Adorama if I can't source some locally. Actually, ordering from Adorama is probably the best option for the reason you specified. I sure don't need to buy 40 liters at a time. There's also a Fuji Hunt office here, but I suspect they only deal with minilabs and professional photofinishers.

 

[hpulley]

I'm using the RA RT Replenisher and Blix kits WITHOUT starter and the results seem good to me. I'm doing room temperature tray development (up to 16x20, any bigger than that and I'd have to figure something else out).

 

[Bob-D659]

Add the starter and the developer doesn't work well at room temp. There are 20x24 trays.

 

[hpulley]

I can barely fit 3 16x20 trays on my table... And I'd need to floor or wall project the enlarger too.

 

[SkipA]

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Are these chemicals actually shipped in 10 liter and 25 gallon packages? Or are they concentrates that dilute to 10 liter or 25 gallons?

 

[hpulley]

The 10L kits dilute to 10L. The developer 10L kit is actually about 1L total of concentrate in 3 bottles while the 10L blix kit is 2 bigger bottles but still much less than 10L.

 

[Bob-D659]

Blix is two 2 liter bottles, but one only has 1.4 liters in it. Dev is three bottles, 2x500 and 1 222ml bottle. Although I'm pretty sure I saw some colour chemicals that are ready to use. Makes shipping expensive.

 

[SkipA]

That's good news. I'll be ordering today. I believe I'll take a pass on the developer starter though, based on what PE says in (there was a url link here which no longer exists) in another thread (there was a url link here which no longer exists). Apparently it is not necessary to use it, and not recommended if you are processing at room temp. I won't be processing at room temp, but I don't see any reason to use the starter if it's not actually necessary. It does make one wonder why it exists if it's not necessary.

Then based on what stevewillard says in (there was a url link here which no longer exists) in thread (there was a url link here which no longer exists), I may also buy some Kodak Ektacolor Developer Additive KP126497. And if I decide to use Trebla's blix, I'll get the Trecon Topping Solution too.

 

[Bob-D659]

The starter is for replenished systems, in effect it makes a fresh tank of dev/replenisher look and process like "used" developer, you might notice some colour shifts as your developer ages and is replenished and stabilizes.

 

[SkipA]

Hmmm. My use of the CP-31 will be intermmitant. I may use it continuously for a couple or three weeks, then put it aside and not come back to it for a couple or three months. My color work will be woven in with my normal work, life, and black and white printing.

During the periods of continuous use, I expect that the CP-31 replenisher unit will keep the solutions stable once they get to the aged and stabilized stage. But after each lengthy hiatus, I'll doubtless be starting with fresh developer for the next period of regular usage. With this pattern of usage, I gather that I would suffer the color shifts during developer aging each time. To avoid that, I could mix each new batch with the starter added.

If my reasoning is correct, then it would be advisable to add the starter back to my shopping list.

Does that make sense?