New to E6 Kodak 6 bath

Discussion in 'Color: Film, Paper, and Chemistry' started by mealers, Mar 3, 2009.

  1. mealers

    mealers Member

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    I recently bought a Jobo CPE-2 from a pro who'd just completely switched to digital. When I mentioned that I'd like to try developing my own E6 he also loaded up the boot of my car with with loads of Kodak 6 bath kit. Their must be at least 6 complete 5L kits all unused and sealed!! Guess that was my lucky day! :smile:

    So now I'm doing some research into developing my own E6 and all the info seems available on the net but I do have a couple questions.

    Bleach - I have 3 bottles of bleach, parts A and B and a replenisher. Do I use these in a similar way to the colour developer, eg mix part A with water and the part B then goes into that? I cant seem to find much info on the bleach and their isnt any mixing instructions on the bottles?

    Final rinse and replenisher - Even though the bottle is sealed and unused there is only half a bottle left, why has this happened and is it still usable?

    Please excuse the very basic questions but these are the only things I need clearing up before I get stuck in.

    Thanks
    Mike
     
  2. Mike Wilde

    Mike Wilde Member

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    Go to kodak's web site and search for manual z-119. It will give you a very good start into the world of e-6 processing.

    I recall that the last e-6 kit I bought had the mixing instructions printed on the box it was shipped in.

    For bleach there is a starter, as I recall, although I am not sure if the 5l kits needed it. There is als a starter for the first developer in some e-6 chemistry too. Some of them you just delete by a measured amount the replenisher to make the working solution that you start with.

    Kodak has a minimum size of standard bottles. There only was ever a half a bottle worth of final rinse when it was packed in the factory
     
  3. tim_walls

    tim_walls Subscriber

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    Seconded - here's the link:
    http://www.kodak.com/global/en/business/retailPhoto/techInfo/zManuals/z119.jhtml
    The Kodak E6 kit I use is -

    First developer
    Reversal bath
    Colour developer
    Pre-bleach
    Bleach
    Fix
    Stabiliser

    That's from memory (am 200 odd miles from home so I can't check ;-) ) so E&OE. It's not 'designed' for replenishment per se - although I see no reason why you couldn't - so I don't know how this maps to the commercial chemicals/replenishment chemicals.

    Instructions for mixing are included in the kit and dead simple. I normally mix either 500ml or 1l at a time and leave the rest in concentrate, as the working solution (bleach notwithstanding) only lasts a week or two.

    The bleach lasts forever*, but if you are using solution mixed some time ago make sure to aerate it thoroughly - I've made the mistake of not doing so and it's rather depressing...


    * yeah, yeah. Comparitively.
     
  4. tim_walls

    tim_walls Subscriber

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    Oh yes, completely from memory so this is very tenuous I think the solutions/mixing instructions in the 5l kit are -

    Water + first developer solution + top up with water to volume.
    Water + reversal solution + top up with water to volume.
    Water + colour dev part A + stir + colour dev part B + top up with water to volume.
    Water + pre-bleach solution + top up with water to volume.
    Water + bleach solution + top up water to volume.
    Water + fixer + top up water to volume.
    Water + stabiliser + top up water to volume.


    Also from memory, but to give an idea of the mixing ratios:
    First dev is in a 1l bottle.
    Reversal bath is in a 500ml or so bottle.
    Colour dev is in two bottles, a brown glass bottle and a small (50ml?) plastic one - forget which way round A or B are.
    Pre-bleach - mid-size bottle (500ml?)
    Bleach - two 1 litre bottles.
    Fixer - medium size bottle.
    Stabiliser - small (50ml?) bottle.


    I don't remember bleach being anything more than a simple dilution exercise - no part A/B/replenisher.

    Edit:
    Found a photo on't web which matches the kits I've had in the UK over the last two years:
    http://static.photo.net/attachments/bboard/00N/00N2b4-39266484.jpg

    Looks like I was mostly right - colour dev part A is actually in a large bottle, and it's part B that's in the glass bottle.

    The photos of the kits you see on all the shopping sites don't actually match what I've ever had delivered (bottles are a different shape if nothing else,) so the formulation may have been changed...

    I suspect either that is the case, or you've got hold of a combination of the all-in-one kits and the commercial/replenishment chemistry (which are definitely different - there's definitely no bleach starter in the current 5l kits.)
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 3, 2009
  5. OP
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    mealers

    mealers Member

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    Thanks for the replies, I guess I should make a few points clearer.
    The chemicals he actually gave me wasnt part of a kit so I dont have any instructions. I've been looking at Kodaks Z-119 but I'm still confused!
    Most of the bottles he has given me are replenishers, can I use these to make working strength solutions or are these usually used for larger commercial operations? (he was also selling another CPE2 and a Coletta processor so I guess he was going through alot of E6)
     
  6. tim_walls

    tim_walls Subscriber

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    Ahh, in that case you've got the commercial chemistry, so you can ignore everything I've written about the 5 litre kits ;-).


    I've never used it, but as I understand it the replenishment chemistry is designed to be used repeatedly, and a certain amount drawn off and replaced with fresh replenisher after a set number of films are developed.

    If you're starting from scratch of course you have a slight problem in that the chemistry hasn't reached its equilibrium point as it were between 'used chemistry' and 'replenisher' - the 'starter' chemistry is designed to be added to the replenisher to kick-start the process; so you start with replenisher+starter, and from then on you just top up with replenisher.


    It's all there in Z-119, it might just take a bit of re-reading a few times... I'm not sure how useful those chems are if you're not doing huge volumes though; the 'normal' working solutions don't have a very long shelf life (bleach and fix excepted,) and if you're not putting the volume through/replenishing often enough I can imagine them going off. I'm speculating entirely though.
     
  7. PHOTOTONE

    PHOTOTONE Member

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    You can use replenishers, as we pros do. The first developer, color developer and bleach require starters, Instructions are on the starters for making working solutions. The other replenishers: Reversal Bath, Pre-Bleach, Fix and Final rinse do not require starters.
     
  8. tiberiustibz

    tiberiustibz Member

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    The kits mix quite easily. Dilutions are written on the flap of the box. You now have $300 of chemistry. Well done.

    The bleach comes in two bottles. They're both the same, it just requires a lot of concentrate. You can use either bottle, or both if you mix up the full 5 liters. I mix up a liter at a time.