negative processing question

[bnjlosh]

I just processed a roll of Ilford FP4 in ID11 and after drying there was a light film over the film...I used water for stop bath, kodak fixer, and perma wash, then I washed it for about 5 minutes, then air dried...could this film be fixer? do I need to try to re-wash, or is this ok??? I haven't tried printing yet...

any pointers greatly appreciated

brad

 

[Nick Zentena]

It's likely your water. A final wash in photo-flo made with distilled water will dry cleaner.

 

[Mike Wilde]

A quicker way to dry as well

In addition to the suggestion of distilled water is to put in a few oz of drug store rubbing alcohol-70 or 99%. It speeds up the whole drying process by accelerating the evaporation of the solution that clings to the film after the wetting agent encourages most of the water to drip off.

I actually use reverse osmosis water out of the little tap that we have installed for drinking water next to the kitchen sink tap, and find no difference in my rend results. It beats dragging bottles of distilled water home.

I usually find that half the rated dosage of photo flow.

Also, take the film off the developing reels to do the final rinse. The photo flow can build up on the reels, and if not thoroughly washed, can cause foaming of the developer on following use of the reels

 

[bnjlosh]

so rewashing with photoflo will help?

 

[Gerald Koch]

From your brief description of the problem it's hard to tell what caused it. Just rewashing may not help. If what comprises the coating is actually stuck to the emulsion you may be out of luck. But, there are some things you can try.

1. Take a look at your fixer, is it cloudy? If so, it may be sulfurizing and should be discarded. In this case what caused the problem is colloidal sulfur which is insoluble in water. Soak the negatives in water with Photo-Flo and then gently wipe them with wet cotton balls to remove the sulfur. Then rinse, and redry.

2. If you used ID-11 FS then the problem might be calcium sulfite from hard water. Did you mix it with tap water or distilled? Is it cloudy? Soak the negatives for a few minutes in 3% acetic acid to dissolve the coating and then rewash. BTW, if you have very hard water and use a high sulfite developer like ID-11 or D-76 then you really do need to use an acid stopbath and not just plain water.

3. If you use Photo-Flo then ignore Kodak's directions. They are trying to sell you this stuff and recommend a solution which is much too concentrated. This will leave a greasy coating on the film. Always use a very dilute Photo-Flo solution (5 drops for each 8 ounces of water). Again, you may need to mechanically remove the coating with cotton balls.

 

[Claire Senft]

It may be helpful to go all the way back to the fixer and reprocess from fixing forward. Photo flo and distilled water for a final rinse is always very good advice.

 

[don sigl]

My first attempt at repair would be to re-fix the negatives in fresh fixer. Then rewash and photoflo.

If the fixer is bad, it may not be clearing all the unexposed silver. It won't hurt to refix the negs and see if they clear.

Regards,

 

[Bob F.]

My first attempt at repair would be to re-fix the negatives in fresh fixer. Then rewash and photoflo.

If the fixer is bad, it may not be clearing all the unexposed silver. It won't hurt to refix the negs and see if they clear.

Regards,

Motion seconded.... If the "light film" is a foggy grey, do it ASAP.

Good luck, Bob.

 

[bnjlosh]

is it possible the perma wash could leave a film?

 

[bnjlosh]

From your brief description of the problem it's hard to tell what caused it. Just rewashing may not help. If what comprises the coating is actually stuck to the emulsion you may be out of luck. But, there are some things you can try.

1. Take a look at your fixer, is it cloudy? If so, it may be sulfurizing and should be discarded. In this case what caused the problem is colloidal sulfur which is insoluble in water. Soak the negatives in water with Photo-Flo and then gently wipe them with wet cotton balls to remove the sulfur. Then rinse, and redry.

2. If you used ID-11 FS then the problem might be calcium sulfite from hard water. Did you mix it with tap water or distilled? Is it cloudy? Soak the negatives for a few minutes in 3% acetic acid to dissolve the coating and then rewash. BTW, if you have very hard water and use a high sulfite developer like ID-11 or D-76 then you really do need to use an acid stopbath and not just plain water.

3. If you use Photo-Flo then ignore Kodak's directions. They are trying to sell you this stuff and recommend a solution which is much too concentrated. This will leave a greasy coating on the film. Always use a very dilute Photo-Flo solution (5 drops for each 8 ounces of water). Again, you may need to mechanically remove the coating with cotton balls.

I did use ID11 full strength...but here in South Carolina our water is relatively soft, so I mixed it with tap water...should I always use distilled for all solutions? (sounds like a stupid question, but I had to ask)

brad

 

[don sigl]

It never hurts to use distilled water for all chemical mixing. However, you may be able to get away with tap water just fine. I use tap water for mixing developer from base compunds. I use distilled water when mixing wetting solutions like photoflo. Stop is tap water or mild acid in tap water. Fixer is usually TF-4 mixed with distilled water, but when I was a student we just used the tap water in the darkrooms for mixing fixer.

So to avoid any nasty surprises, use distilled water, but if you find your tap water isn't having any negative affects, I would use it.

Regards,

 

[Gerald Koch]

I find that the cost of using distilled/de-ionized water is very small in comparison to the ease of mind that using it provides. Just because your water is relatively soft doesn't mean that it doesn't have a lot of other things in it.

However, you can remove the temporary hardness simply by boiling the water for a few minutes and allowing it to stand overnight. The calcium hardness will precipitate out and settle to the bottom of the container. You can either filter the water or decant off the clear portion.

Calcium sulfite can be a problem with the use of alkaline fixers and a water rinse rather than an acid stopbath.

 

[bnjlosh]

thanks for the assistance everyone...it looks like I didn't do the final wash long enough...everything looks good after going a bit longer...I thought perma wash was supposed to reduce the final wash time? and I used photoflo, too...

thanks

 

[lowellh]

One of the draw backs of powder formulas, especially those formulated in the early part of the last century, is that they do not have any "anti-cals" in them to deal with the variations in water. Certainly, we add them to our liquids and most modern liquid formulas do as well. This eliminates the need for "treated water."

 

[Zathras]

One of the draw backs of powder formulas, especially those formulated in the early part of the last century, is that they do not have any "anti-cals" in them to deal with the variations in water. Certainly, we add them to our liquids and most modern liquid formulas do as well. This eliminates the need for "treated water."

I've mixed many of those old formulas using filtered tap water and never had a problem. I still use distilled water for the wetting agent, just to be on the safe side.