Medium Format camera -> start?

Maël · Jan 30, 2012

Hi all,

I've been eye balling medium format camera's the past weeks and I've gained quiet an interest in a medium format camera.
Now I was wondering which would be my options and therefore started this topic.
What I shoot mostly: Interiors, Objects, Spaces, and sometimes a bit landscape
My style: I like compact, I like that I can take it easily with me so the smaller the form the better..
Aspect ratio, because of what I shoot I assume 6x6, 6x7, 6x8 and 6x9 are my formats. But then again I could be wrong at this?
Budget (probably the most important part): it's not much it's as small as 300 ish in Euro, small budget because I'm only a student and because I don't photograph every day I can lose the interest for a month and then regain the interest. It's an on / off relationship.
Lens: because of the budget I hope on one allround lens which fits my needs for all the things I want to shoot. Probably something at the wider end?

Camera's I looked at: Mamiya 6 and 7 though too expensive, Mamiya 67 less expensive but still above my budget most of the time, and it's kinda big
Kiev probably isn't a wise choice, and hasselblad is expensive and not too small either.

thanks ahead,

EthanFrank · Jan 30, 2012

Why not start with a TLR? A Yashica or even a used Rolleicord will be well within your budget, and they're great fun.

Dan Daniel · Jan 30, 2012

Get a 6x4.5 SLR. Good bang for the buck, lots of lens options, not too big to carry around in a pack, easy to sell when you get bored or figure out what you really want out of medium format.

Or a TLR. My favorite kind of camera.

snederhiser · Jan 30, 2012

Hello;
Mamiya 645 is a good system, 55mm lens is cheap. Also have a Kiev 60 mlu that works well, like the russian glass. TLR's are also a good choice, if you can get by with a 80mm lens. Steven.

holmburgers · Jan 30, 2012

I just picked up a Kowa Six, "the poor man's Hasselblad". It's a good camera, with a wide range of lenses. 6x6, not small but not huge, and fairly well made. One in good condition should last you a long time.

I also toyed with getting a Mamiya 645; the older style can be had for good prices.

ntenny · Jan 30, 2012

I love TLRs, but a fixed lens might be kind of limiting for interiors (and maybe "spaces", depending on what you mean by it). That said, they're still an inexpensive and fun port of entry into the MF world, and a decent one (Rolleicord or Yashica, e.g.) is an excellent camera for applications where a normal lens is appropriate.

-NT

PaulMD · Jan 30, 2012

A TLR will not be the best thing for your needs. If you shoot interiors, you probably want a 35mm or 28mm equivalent wideangle. The Bronica gear is cheap, Mamiya 645 is a bit more, Kowa is good but the wideangles are rare-ish. If you can swing it, the Fuji GS645S/GS645W 60mm/45mm rangefinders are really great shooters.

Rick A · Jan 30, 2012

If you like compact, a Mamiya 6 or 7 range finder models, Bessa 667, Yashica TLR for light weight slightly larger than a RF camera. I also recommenr the Kowa 6 or Super66.

keithwms · Jan 30, 2012

Well, first of all, medium format offers more diversity than any other area in photography. Way more diversity. There are medium format SLRs, RFs, TLRs, view cameras of every type, you name it. So take a tour if you can- try to get some gear in your hands and get a feeling for what will help you feel productive when you use it.

I know this isn't practical for everyone, but when I first got into medium format, I tried literally a dozen or so cameras of all sorts. And actually I never settled on any one particular camera- they all have particular strengths. So I wound up keeping more cameras than I probably should have Their specialized abilities are what made them attractive to me. So... as of now my most productive medium format cameras are 6x7 SLRs and 6x6 RFs.

I am not sure why big old TLRs tend to come up as people's favourite starters, I find them very limited for most of what I do, but everybody's mileage varies.... so definitely try them and try everything you can.

If you like the Mamiya RFs but the price tag was too high, consider the older fixed lens Fuji RFs. Similar ergonomics and ease of use, fantastic level of detail, but much lower cost. Look at the GA645W in particular, that one is good fun. The GA645Zi is now overpriced in my opinion, it's is a lot of fun but the price has gotten a bit ridiculous. I mean, the zoom range is rather narrow. I had one and a 645W and used the latter more than the Zi. The older folders are fun too but don't base your impression of medium format performance on those, most of them are not up to par with what you can get from their nonfolding cousins, notwithstandign the pricey bessa 3.

Aristophanes · Jan 30, 2012

I picked up a Mamiya 645e with 45mm/2.8 N lens and 80mm/2.8 lens for under US$200, with an extra insert.

45mm is not architecture super-wide, but it's pretty good, and a Mamiya package with a 45mm is actually fairly common. They are not small cameras, but they're not that big either. and they usually can be found close to your price range,.

BrianL · Jan 30, 2012

If doing interiors, consider if a shift-tilt feature or lens might be one of the higher level considerations. If so that limits MF options somewhat and maybe more economical to move up to LF with a roll film back such as a Speed Graphi. Not sure if the Mamyia C series that uses a bellows allows for such movement. Some old folders could also fit the bill or be modded but, have to watch for vignetting.

Jeff Kubach · Jan 30, 2012

I would go with a TLR. Yashica is a good choice wirhout the high price.

Jeff

SimonSutcliffe · Jan 30, 2012

Mamiya rb67 IS AWESOME just got it two days ago its amazing... but on the large side. Save the money that you pay your gym membership.

alex66 · Jan 30, 2012

I have 3 medium format cameras that are in regular use: A Fuji GS645s, a nice fairly compact rangefinder that weighs less than a lot of AF 35mm SLR's. It has a very good lens and is nice to use but ono the down side the RF patch is poor. A Yashicamat 124, it is again a nice weight and the lens is of they can be had for real bargain prices, the viewfinder is a bit dark though. Lastly I recently bought a Mamiya 645j cost me about £120 with two lenses and the plain prism, I bought another lens and metering head for it. For me it can feel heavy though as I have fybromyalgia but it is nice to use and I can focus a lot closer with her than the other cameras. If you want to dip your toe then a TLR like the Yashicamat's are a low cost way in, an SLR will though give you the most options. When you look at the big negs though you will be hooked!

EKDobbs · Jan 30, 2012

My two cents echo the 645 supporters. It's what I've started on (Mamiya 645 Pro, 110 2.8), very economical, adaptable camera. The 645 format also squeezes nicely into 8x10, and it allows 15 frames per roll instead of 12 like the 6x7. My only complaint is that it's pretty heavy, which is status-quo for MF SLRs. If that's a concern, consider a rangefinder or small TLR. In fact, get your hands on one to see. Really, you don't realize how chunky they are till you hold one.

fotch · Jan 31, 2012

I would recomend you consider a folder. You may need to up your budget or acept an older camera, however, folders are a lot of fun, very compact when folded, give large high quality negatives or slides, up to 6x9. Anyway, just a thought. Good luck.

trickydan · Jan 31, 2012

I started (and am still using) a Mamiya 645 1000s, highly recommend it too! I like the idea of a Mamiya RB67, as they're a relatively cheap massive [medium] format option (about $300 or so for a cheap camera and 90mm), but the 645 series has such great lenses too! you can definitely get a more expensive 35mm or 45mm, ive got the 55 and 80mm 1.9, which is the fastest MF lens around! Superb for low light, use that and rate the new Porta 400 at 1600 and you can do almost anything! Also, as others have mentioned having 15 frames per roll is a bit nicer than 10 or 12

Maël · Jan 31, 2012

Wow ! thanks for the ton of reactions what a cool forum!

So a list of camera's for which I should be hunting:

- Mamiya 645 with 45 or 55 mm lens ( as I understand there are different 645 models, newer and older ones?)
- Yashica 124 mat
- Fuji 645's (like the compacter form factor of these)

Other camera's where I would like some opinions on.
-> I came across a Mamiya super 23 with a 6x9 filmholder and 100 mm lens (would prefer more wide angle though), it was out of my budget range but it wasn't really far out of my budget.. What are your thoughts on this camera? isn't it worth it and are the others mentioned above better options? I really liked the 'look' of this camera
-> Pentacon six can be found for quiet cheap. are the others mentioned above far better options ? or..?

thanks ahead!

keithwms · Jan 31, 2012

Consider the fuji gw690 and the gsw and related 6x7 and 6x8 versions too, if you want larger/longer negs. But the Fuji 645s will wow you for sure.

clayne · Jan 31, 2012

I think you mean Fuji, Keith.

keithwms · Jan 31, 2012

Yes sorry, fuji gsw690 and fuji gw690, and there are 6x7 and 6x8 versions too. thanks clayne.

EKDobbs · Jan 31, 2012

Maël said:
Wow ! thanks for the ton of reactions what a cool forum!

So a list of camera's for which I should be hunting:

- Mamiya 645 with 45 or 55 mm lens ( as I understand there are different 645 models, newer and older ones?)

thanks ahead!

Anything before the M645 Super (M645, 1000s, J) doesn't have a removable back. For me, removable backs are awesome, but if you can do without, the older models are cheaper. Also, the new series does not share all accessories with the old series, grips especially. After a bit of research, I've found that the only one you should avoid is the M645 J. It was an export model that's missing a few features (mirror lockup being the most important). The rest of them are good, and they all share the same lens mount.

Also, keep in mind that on a 645 camera, a 45mm has the same FOV as a 28mm, and a 55mm the same as a 35mm. 80mm is considered "standard", but if you do architecture/landscapes, 45mm lens is probably the best.

keithwms · Jan 31, 2012

If you do go for a mamiya 645 slr, my vote for a starter kit would be for the 645 pro and an 80/1.9, which is very bright and good for learning WLF focus. Next you can add a prism and winder. It's a very nice, modular kit. The minor drawback of the pro is that it's not 100% mechanical- you do need a battery... but it seems to last forever. Can't remember last time I needed to replace it.

The 45mm is indeed very nice. Among the best.

SafetyBob · Feb 3, 2012

If you haven't totally decided what you want yet, allow me to add my two cents too.

I love my Mamiya 645 Pro and started out with the 80mm lense. Added a winder, AE prism and there was my favorite MF shooter. I still love it, still use it routinely. You mentioned a Super 23......please do NOT consider one unless you get it from a user that has well cared for it. Most all of them lived a very hard life as press cameras, however, once CLA'ed and adjusted and you have a lot of time on your hands, the interchangeable backs and options are superior as is the results. I takes a lot of money to get one in good shape and get all the goodies with it.......let's wait a few years, then consider getting one.

I have most all the Mamiya lenses that go with the 645 so read up here about your options. One or two is all you should need to start. Need flash, the 645 Pro will integrate very nicely with all the old and now cheap Metz potato masher flashes (60 CT1 for example....), I started out very cheaply with an old Canon G533 potato masher which worked very well.

Bob E.

pbromaghin · Feb 3, 2012

keithwms said:
I am not sure why big old TLRs tend to come up as people's favourite starters, I find them very limited for most of what I do, but everybody's mileage varies.... so definitely try them and try everything you can.

Because they're chick magnets.

Medium Format camera -> start?

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