Making a D23 Concentrate of sorts

Discussion in 'B&W: Film, Paper, Chemistry' started by Saganich, Jan 3, 2018.

  1. Saganich

    Saganich Subscriber

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    I'm suffering from excessive darkroom temps of which I have no control. Normally my D23 is 70-72F but lately it's up around 80F. I thought I might mix a new batch into half the volume and dilute with colder water. Has anyone tried this with D23? More importantly am I missing some major reason why this wouldn't work? Thanks.
     
  2. Pioneer

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    I mix my D-23 1 liter at a time and usually use it 1:3, sometimes 1:1. This would allow you to use cooler water to bring down your solution temp.

    If you use it straight then a small refrigerator may also assist in keeping the solution cool.
     
  3. voceumana

    voceumana Member

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    If you are not fixated upon using D23, you could always use D76 and dilute 1:1 for one-time use or use HC-110, Rodinal, or any of the other highly concentrated developers. D23 was designed to be a simplified D76. I'm not sure if its easy to mix D23 at double-strength, but it is such a simple formula, why not just try it? Definitely use distilled water if you are going to try this.
     
  4. BradS

    BradS Member

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    I've used a lot of homemade D-23 but I've not tried it making it with half the water. It seems like it would be difficult to get all of the Sodium sulfite into solution.

    Here in Sonora, it is not uncommon for ambient temps to reach 100+ degrees F during summer. I use an ice bath to chill the hot developer down to working temperature. Simply pour the D-23 (or D-76) into a beaker with a thermometer in it and hold the beaker in a tub of water with ice cubes in it. Watch the thermometer and remove the beaker from the ice bath when the dev reaches the desired temp. This is far more accurate than trying to get a specific temperature by diluting with cold water (which I never have in summer either).
     
  5. Anon Ymous

    Anon Ymous Member

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    Sodium sulfite solubility is about 270g/l, sounds about doable to make a double strength concentrate. I've certainly dissolved 200g/l sodium sulfite, the extra Metol needed will probably not make things that harder.
     
  6. Pioneer

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    ???

    What?
     
  7. Pixophrenic

    Pixophrenic Member

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    There is nothing wrong with using D23 at your current "room temperature". Most modern films will tolerate 80 F just fine. Just use a few 5-frame strips with bracketed exposures and determine the optimum time for your film(s). In fact, some old manuals stated that the optimal temperature for this developer was 75 F.
     
  8. Patrick Robert James

    Patrick Robert James Subscriber

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    Most of the year I develop film at 80º and above. Just use it the way it is if you like it. You will get the same results, just faster!
     
  9. voceumana

    voceumana Member

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    The Film Developing Cookbook
    (Stephen Anchell U& Bill Troop), page 44:

    "D-23 was intended by Henn to be a simple to formulate replacement for D-76. Indeed, one of the state functions of D-23 is to provide a more reliable alternative to D-76, expecially when replenishment is obligatory (as in commercial labs of fifty years ago)."

    Ref: R. W. Henn & J. J. Crabtree, An Elon-Sulfite Developer and an Elon-Sulfite-Bisulfite Fine Grain Developer. J. PSA 10:727 (1944)8
     
  10. Pioneer

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    Thank you.

    Learn something new every day.
     
  11. mshchem

    mshchem Member

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    I haven't used D-23 since the Nixon/Ford administrations. Nice stuff. If your lucky enough to have 80 F ambient I wouldn't think solubility would be an issue.

    You might just try to make up a "normal" batch with half the water first, if it stays in solution should work IMHO.

    Making solutions from scratch is fun. Get a white labcoat :smile:
    Best Regards, Mike
     
  12. Rudolf Karachun

    Rudolf Karachun Subscriber

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    Many sourses actually recommended to dissolve D23 at temperature about 90 degrees or even higher in about 500 ml. liters and after add cold water to 1 liter. I never paid attention to these recommendations and dissolve chemicals in the water at room temperature. But when I did it last December in the cold darkroom and cold water, the metol turned in the snow flakes when i add it to the water. I discard it and dissolved the new batch of chemicals in 500ml. Of water @ 80 deg. F, and add hot water to make temperature 20deg. It works perfect.
     
  13. Rudolf Karachun

    Rudolf Karachun Subscriber

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    During the summer to cool the chemicals I use the water bath with the plastic germetic reusable ise packs for the portable coolers.
     
  14. Rudolf Karachun

    Rudolf Karachun Subscriber

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    I mean 20deg. Celsius of course.
     
  15. baachitraka

    baachitraka Member

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    There is no real benefit in using D-23 apart from mixing it at home ;-). I may stick either with liquid concentrates or D-76.

    Other liquid concentrate you can mix at home is PC-TEA. Amazing developer.

    For me was other way around, temps fall below 20°¢ and I have to warm it before using it.
     
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    Saganich

    Saganich Subscriber

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    Thanks for all the replies. I suppose double strength would be possible given the solubility of sodium sulfite, but I realized (once my brain started firing yesterday) it would have to be a one shot situation without replenishment so double strength wouldn't get enough developed before I had to mix more (lazy). I've been mixing D23 for a long time and at high temp and short development times it works well and is easy to get higher contrast and in the low light of winter this may be an advantage I didn't consider. Makes me also consider the 10yr old bottle of Rodinol on the shelf...gets better with age...right?