How do you make money with your darkroom?

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thedancefloor

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I really liked the thread: How do you make money with your medium format camera?
(there was a url link here which no longer exists)

It's one thing to be a great shooter and market your photography, but I think that there might be a larger market for the person who can make prints for other photographers. My local lab has stopped doing B&W for a few years now, and they've told me that people are still asking about it.

What would be the tools and resources you'd need to run a profitable black and white lab?
 

Ryuji

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If you are in any business you know this, but people keeps asking about stuff that they have no intention of paying for.

I didn't make much money but made some by inventing Silvergrain family of b&w processing chemicals. But that's not something I suggest to others...
 

Rick A

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I process film for a few locals who don't have their own dark rooms. None of my clients desire to do their own as they either don't shoot enough black and white, or don't have the space to justify the outlay for dark room gear. I also print for about half my clients, the rest use hybrid workflow methods.
 

Steve Roberts

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I don't think I'd want to get into printing other people's work as pretty much everyone left in analogue photography is by definition keen and discerning. I know that if anyone else printed my shots I'd be thinking "Could have done with dodging/burning/being lighter/being darker/cropping here", etc.. Renting out a darkroom might be a better bet especially if it's your own that you have anyway and if like mine it's actually only used for a small fraction of the time it could be. Then there's the matter of who do you rent it to and do you trust them not to nick the family silver or (even worse) dip into your stash of paper?

Steve
 

removed account4

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it is a matter of knowing how much your materials cost and charging something you can live with.
all you really need is a darkroom and the materials you use to print and process your own work.
and keep in mind, that you might have to print a few different "versions" of a print at first,
until you and your clients are on the same page interpretation-wise.

good luck !
john
 

TheFlyingCamera

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A darkroom is kind of like a house or a boat - it's a hole in the ground/water that you pour money into. Unless you can offer a specialty service that people can't get elsewhere (say platinum printing or other alternative process support) it's highly unlikely that you can earn a living with a darkroom. Make some money? maybe. Maybe even make enough to clear a small profit after your expenses are recovered. Anything more than that is somewhere between flying pigs and frozen inferno.
 

jp498

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To make a little money, start with a bigger amount of money. Seriously though, if you could process batches of rolls of film, it might be worthwhile. Figure an hour of labor for any processing, plus chemicals, sleeves, etc... It wouldn't be worthwhile to do 1-2 rolls for someone at a time. 3-5 rolls, perhaps.

I'd let the customer scan them if they want to. You could make a little money teaching them how, but otherwise scanning other people's stuff is drudgery. If you're good at it, teaching would probably be the steadiest way to make money at it. A local adult ed program or community college might hire you if you don't want to do the billing yourself or if you want to get your name out in the community as a competent instructor.
 
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There's probably potential to save money by not doing something more expensive like drinking alcohol or browsing ebay.
 

jordanstarr

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Even if you're a great printer, I doubt you'll make much money, if anything at all. The greatest printers in the world still struggle to survive and even then, they have to adjust to market demands in some capacity (offer film/print scanning services, teaching photography workshops, etc.) and do not strictly do printing and film developing in the darkroom. I hope Bob Carnie will chime into this thread at some point with his experiences in Toronto and his knowledge of the printing industry.
 

ic-racer

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I have heard a wooden boat described as "a hole in the water, surrounded by wood, into which one throws money." I'd describe my darkroom as something similar.
 
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gary mulder

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I have heard a wooden boat described as "a hole in the water, surrounded by wood, into which one throws money." I'd describe a darkroom as something similar.

No prospects here. I build my self a wooden boat AND I have a dark room.
 

Bob Carnie

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Sorry I cannot answer this one properly.... I did not get into printing for the money. The OP knows or should know if it will work, no matter what the economic situation is - good times come and go, its the OP's desire to make it happen is what's important. If you have to ask how to do it I doubt there is much chance of success IMO, I started Silver Shack in a recession, 20 years later we are in another one.


Even if you're a great printer, I doubt you'll make much money, if anything at all. The greatest printers in the world still struggle to survive and even then, they have to adjust to market demands in some capacity (offer film/print scanning services, teaching photography workshops, etc.) and do not strictly do printing and film developing in the darkroom. I hope Bob Carnie will chime into this thread at some point with his experiences in Toronto and his knowledge of the printing industry.
 

Bob Carnie

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Robert - a dangerous line of work- If it is a digital rental area maybe.

Great timing on this thread... I've been crunching the numbers for the idea of taking over a rental darkroom here in San Diego and trying to figure out if I could make it fly.
 

MattKing

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Great timing on this thread... I've been crunching the numbers for the idea of taking over a rental darkroom here in San Diego and trying to figure out if I could make it fly.

The rental darkrooms that seem to be most successful around here are ones that are associated with existing communities of potential users - especially if there are nearby photo schools with facilities that have limited capacities.

Low overhead is apparently critical!
 

winger

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I have a darkroom because I like to use it. But I did find someone here who wanted silver gelatin prints from old glass negatives and didn't mind what I charge. Maybe I charge too little, but it covers supplies, daycare (to give me the time to do it), plus some. I don't always have stuff from him to print, but when I do it's sorta worth it.
 
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thedancefloor

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Thanks for the responses everyone. I plan to shoot weddings and offer 150 or so FB 5x7s etc. So I'm thinking that while I'm at it, I could be printing for other photographers too.
 

pentaxuser

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The thread is about 8 years old now. I wonder what dancefloor decided to do in the end and how successful it was?

pentaxuser
 

Helge

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I’d think a darkroom would only make money today as part of a complete photographers business, where you take photos of stuff people care about (kids, themselves, grandma their car etc.) in ways they don’t know they want, and can’t do themselves, and then sell the finished print to them at 3X markup for materials and a good hourly pay for yourself.

The real art is going to be selling the idea to them.
Being a good photographer and printer is just the very basic ground and start.
 

Down Under

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Another ancient thread pops up out of the woodwork. I recall this one from - eight years ago, wow! It will be interesting to see what comments are added to it now.

How to make money from a darkroom? By selling the gear But expect only cents on the dollar.

Bad jokes aside, for the past thirty years I've offered an occasional film processing and print-making service to fellow photographers who either couldn't find these locally or wanted specialized work (pull/push processing, hand made prints with dodging/special effects, C41 cross-processed, and the like). On average, I did from 6 to 12 jobs every year. One factor that may have worked against me in this, was my pricing structure - whoever wanted my work had to pay my prices, and I never, ever cut my fees or for that matter my costs, which often as not came dangerously close to what I was charging. I did it purely for the love of the work. Unrealistic or unreasonable demands were declined and more than one an objectionable would-be client was politely but firmly shown to the door and told to shop elsewhere. In other words, I did it for the enjoyment of it.

In the last ten years my work flow went down by half and more, which didn't concern me as I was basically into it for the fun anyway and not the profit. Last year in Tasmania, where more film shooters seem to congregate (retirement age is a key factor in this, unlike in the rest of Australia where young film shooters are now on the increase), I did four jobs and a fairly big (and much too time-consuming for my liking) archival printing project for a state agency which got cancelled halfway through the printing, but I was adequately paid off for my curtailed services and extra stocks of printing paper and chemistry I had pre-ordered at client's request, so I didn't lose money. For the rest of the work I just about broke even after costs, not including my time which again wasn't a concern as I'm now retired. At year's end we relocated back to the mainland and we are now in country Victoria, so it seems unlikely I'll get any darkroom work in 2020, some friends do ask but so far nothing has eventuated. Again, this suits me fine.

Helge (#22) hit the nail on the head with all this. According to my Melbourne suppliers, B&W films still sell reasonably well to mostly older photographers, but the young'uns are now shooting C41 and want to get it processed quickly and cheaply at small city labs, those few that still exist in this digi-everything era. With old SLR cameras being flogged off on Ebay at an average price of A$100 including lens, the Two And Six mentality prevails (for those of you unfamiliar with the English monetary system, this means 2/6, two shillings sixpence - small change) and nobody is prepared to pay any serious money for anything photographic, even assuming a few out there still now quality results when they see it, let alone how to achieve it.

I know of one community darkroom in Ballarat, our nearest regional center, but it's now closed due to the Covid crisis. There may be a few in Melbourne, but i have to say I'm now completely out of touch with most of what goes on in photography there. Not even sure if that venerable institution, the Melbourne Camera Club, is still in operation, I recall they did have a darkroom at one time but the majority of their members are likely centenarians now and this facility may well be closed like the rest.

Small home darkrooms are probably the way of the future. I've kept the best of my gear including two fine enlargers (Leitz 35mm and multiformat LPL) and of course my Jobo units, but when we moved back to the mainland a large box of still usable processing tanks and quite a bit of chemistry was donated to various photographers who still use these and, sadly, the rest went to a local charity shop for want of a good home. For me it was all very Marie Kondo and it at times it felt like trying to give away a litter of kittens.

Others may differ in their thoughts about all this. Will the OP kindly give us an update? I will be greatly interested in the response.
 

Helge

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Addendum.
I don’t think it’s impossible to sell B&W prints. There is most certainly a market.
But first there is the problems of visibility.
You can stand at the highest building of the city shouting in a bullhorn for days, give out fliers, and then still have people come to you and say “if only I had known” or “I never realized...”.
Granted a good percentage is going to be polite lies.
But in general people don’t and can’t see or remember what they are not into or concerned with right now.

The second problem is convincing people that you are the best, and worth your money and the next guy is worse and that they can’t do it themselves, by turning an iPhone photo B&W and printing it at the photo dealers.

People don’t take long speeches, so it will have to be something succinct, preferably visual too (which is tough since as much as they love themselves, their kin and their belongings. They couldn’t care less about other people’s) that hits them right in the heart and makes them forget about money.
 

Donald Qualls

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"I make photographs the way your granddad would have. Call me." and a phone number. Print this on business cards and distribute them.
 
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