help - preventing lint when drying prints using Ilford MGFB warmtone

[davidh]

I'm using a 2nd hand (which is probably the big part of the problem) ferrotype print dryer. I've inspected the canvas and also ran a vaccum cleaner over it numerous times, then checked it with some tape and a magnifying glass to see if I'd removed any lint/hair/etc. The tape comes off clean.

However the emulsion on this paper gets tackier during the drying process and invariably some lint from the drying belt (that wasn't there before I set the print in it) sticks to the emulsion. In some cases ruining the print, other times there are maybe one or two that can only be noticed if one knows what to look for and uses a 3X or better magnifier.

I love the results with this paper. But outside of using the ferrotype dryer I can't get it to dry without distorting. Ilford recommends against using a blotter book with this paper as the image might stick, and after working with it I comprehend the reason behind this warning.

Does anyone have any alternative drying methods that will keep the paper flat and also prevent nasty things adhering to the emulsion whilst it dries?

Thanks,

David

 

[Bruce Osgood]

I would confirm that you are using the correct temperature for this paper. If are using the glossy (Not sure they make any other?) remember the surface will melt to some degree or another and probably pull fibers out of the canvas belt on cooling. You are drying the print surface to the belt and not the plated surface of the dryer?

Unless you are prepared to ferrotype the glossy paper I would try and air dry them.

Just my 2 cents.

 

[Bob F.]

You could dry it on screens and worry about getting it flat afterwards (but then, I have a dry-mount press so that's easy for me to say...). Sans mounting press, after drying on screens, put under pressure for a couple of days - may or may not work: does for some, doesn't for others. I wonder if you can almost-dry the prints on screens or hung on a line and use the ferrotype/dryer to flatten them afterwards while there is still a little moisture in the paper?

Some have reported success with taping fibre prints to glass sheets and letting them dry. Not tried it myself.

Another option to try, if you have not already, is to use a sacrificial sheet of paper between the apron and the emulsion. Again, no idea if it will work, but might be worth a try.

Good luck, Bob.

 

[davidh]

Yes, I sacrificed one sheet of this paper testing it with the ferrotype dryer emulsion side down - it's a pearl finish (semi-matte I believe) paper. That was definatley a mistake, but I managed to peel the bits and pieces off of the plated surface. So I dry prints with the emulsion side toward the canvas belt.

The dryer has 5 settings, 1 lowest to 5 highest, I have been drying on 2, but I'll try 1 or a little lower and see.

I've tried simply air drying the paper in my film drying cabinet - built it myself and it has a fan to draw air through, and a filter over the air intake to prevent dust - simple air drying doesn't keep the paper from curling and distorting. I suppose it could be too much temp for the finish. It's a fiber base paper - I have none such problems with rosin coat papers, but they lack the feel of fiber based.

I'll try the lowest temp setting possible and see what happens.

Thanks,

David

I would confirm that you are using the correct temperature for this paper. If are using the glossy (Not sure they make any other?) remember the surface will melt to some degree or another and probably pull fibers out of the canvas belt on cooling. You are drying the print surface to the belt and not the plated surface of the dryer?

Unless you are prepared to ferrotype the glossy paper I would try and air dry them.

Just my 2 cents.

 

[Jon Shiu]

Hi, if you air dry the prints on screens or a line without any heat you should be okay. Make sure to wipe off all water drops with a photo wipe. I think that you are used to RC paper, but shouldn't use heat when air drying fiber.

Jon

 

[davidh]

Thank you - I will try the taping method onto something that will allow the paper to dry. This will probably greatly increase the drying time, but if I could get them to dry pretty much flat they could be matted sooner, and shipped sooner - etc...

Ideally though I'll be dry mounting my fiber prints as soon as I can afford the dry mount press. YIKES those things are expen$ive!! I've tried some photo mount adhesive - however since fiber papers are absorbent I had a couple of disasters with the adhesive - even in a very light coat - soaking through the paper and reacting with the dry emulsion to leave a light stain. Not good.

I've tried using a piece of sacrificed 11X14 rosin coat between the image to be dried and the belt, rosin coated surface on the 11X14 paper >away< from the print, but what I've found is that the water has no place to go and beads up on the bottom of the RC paper, affecting the image quality and finish. On setting 2 I baby-sat one image for 25 minutes, but because the RC paper held the moisture the print didn't completely dry, so I tried leaving the belt off the paper, but it began to curl pretty quickly. I wound up putting the belt over it and luckily, especially since this is a customer order, I had one slight piece of lint adhere, but I was able to carefully remove it. Most times though it dries into the emulsion or the finish and that's the end of the story.

I'll work through some of your suggestions

Thanks!

David

You could dry it on screens and worry about getting it flat afterwards (but then, I have a dry-mount press so that's easy for me to say...). Sans mounting press, after drying on screens, put under pressure for a couple of days - may or may not work: does for some, doesn't for others. I wonder if you can almost-dry the prints on screens or hung on a line and use the ferrotype/dryer to flatten them afterwards while there is still a little moisture in the paper?

Some have reported success with taping fibre prints to glass sheets and letting them dry. Not tried it myself.

Another option to try, if you have not already, is to use a sacrificial sheet of paper between the apron and the emulsion. Again, no idea if it will work, but might be worth a try.

Good luck, Bob.

 

[Bob F.]

Try using fibre paper rather than RC for the paper between the print and the apron - the moisture can escape then (but the emulsion may stick.... catch 22).

Have fun! Bob.

 

[Roger Hicks]

I had the same problem, albeit with another Ilford paper, even with a new apron (which came with my s/h glazer). Ilford's recommendation was to use a hardening fixer.

Cheers,

Roger (www.rogerandfrances.com)

 

[davidh]

True, I read that notice about hardening fixers - the caveat then being they suggest the paper won't accept toning nearly as well - and I like the effect selenium has on this paper - it brings out the warms much better and gives the image a brown cast.

So, with that being said - let me ask this. I use Ilfords non-hardening fixer. I realize it would add a few extra steps to the development process. Let's say I was to continue on with my current processing - washing the print for a few minutes after the selenium bath. After this step could I conceivably turn around and re-fix the print in a hardening fixer, repeat the rinsing step and then dry? Or would a 2nd fixing step foul things up?

Ilford does say this paper can be dried in a ferrotype dryer, so I will find the solution. I thought of sacrificing a sheet of the same fiber based paper, but figured the image would stick to the bottom surface of the other paper. In the spirit of experimentation I'll give it a try and see what happens.

Thanks!

David

I had the same problem, albeit with another Ilford paper, even with a new apron (which came with my s/h glazer). Ilford's recommendation was to use a hardening fixer.

Cheers,

Roger (www.rogerandfrances.com)

 

[Jon Shiu]

Hi, fixer with hardener will require longer washing times (1 hour?). Maybe you could just air dry and then use the print dryer just to flatten.

Jon

 

[Bob F.]

Sounds like a good idea but you don't need to re-fix - you could make up a separate hardener bath and use that before the final (long) wash. Fotospeed and Tetenal sell separate hardening baths and IIRC, Ilford sell the hardening part of their fixer separately so that may be the easiest way to go instead of mixing your own hardening bath from potassium alum or somesuch. I suppose the changes to the gelatine may cause a colour shift, but I've no idea - worth a try in any case.

Cheers, Bob.

[Edit] Just realised there may be a particular reason the hardener is mixed with the fixer that I don't know about, so if any of our resident chemists see a problem with this idea, please speak up!