Fyi- Slight modification to new members access in order to prevent classifieds scamming.

Sean · Jul 18, 2022

Hi All,

The current rule was minimum 20 posts to be able to send private messages. We got caught out by a scammer who rapidly made 20 posts and then hit up WTB ads. I've now set an additional roadblock that requires the 20 posts but also to be registered for at least 5 days. This should give us more time to identify scammers.

Thanks,
Sean

AgX · Jul 18, 2022

Good Idea.

Also you might add to the rule lay-out in the making, that these posts must not be nonsence postings.
Next to hinting at the reasons for the 5 day 20 posts restriction, you may also hint at getting acquainted here, to bring up a positive aspect.

Sean · Jul 18, 2022

AgX said:
Good Idea.

Also you might add to the rule lay-out in the making, that these posts must not be nonsence postings.
Next to hinting at the reasons for the 5 day 20 posts restriction, you may also hint at getting acquainted here, to bring up a positive aspect.

I've updated this part of the new member notice to indicate this:

"will not be available until you have posted at least 20 (genuine, not filler) messages"...

Nitroplait · Jul 18, 2022

Great Sean. Thanks for doing this.

Just playing the devils advocate: a scammer may sign up and wait 'till after 5 days and make 20 nonsense posts in 10 min. and we may be in the same situation.

Would the system allow to be configured so that after you have posted 20 posts, you must wait 5 days before you can PM? Then there is at least a little time to detect the scammer behaviour before they can operate.

AgX · Jul 18, 2022

Yes, but at least it is a further hurdle.

Concerning the detection of spams. A more even spread of moderation over time zones would be benefitial.
But, Sean aside, Photrio is no commercial thing with assistants on shift 24/7.

It finally ends at "members beware"...

Nitroplait · Jul 18, 2022

AgX said:
It finally ends at "members beware"...

Absolutely.

Don_ih · Jul 18, 2022

What if the new member had a "probationary" status that, in conjunction with the 20 post, 5 day minimum, would see his/her privileges put on hold if he/she was reported - prior to any review in moderation. It would amount to a minor inconvenience to authentic members being incorrectly reported, but it would stop potential scammers while they awaited moderation.

ic-racer · Jul 18, 2022

I'd make it 30 days before they can set up a scam via PM.

juan · Jul 18, 2022

We’ve had this problem with responses to WTB posts on my musical instrument forums, too. They’ve all done similar moderation things. It all comes down to trying to sure who you’re buying from.

mtnbkr · Jul 18, 2022

Folks, the time delay doesn't really matter. Scammers are aware of these tactics and will set up accounts well in advance of their plans to use them. It really does come down to "buyer/seller beware" and only accepting methods of payment that have built-in protection mechanisms (NOT PP F&F). If the person sounds suspicious or the deal is "too good to be true", then walk away.

Chris

FotoD · Jul 18, 2022

Nitroplait said:
Just playing the devils advocate: a scammer may sign up and wait 'till after 5 days and make 20 nonsense posts in 10 min. and we may be in the same situation.

Yes, the 5 day delay would have to be *after* 20 posts or it makes little difference.

Eric Rose · Jul 18, 2022

Bad guys will be bad guys. It's almost impossible to stop them. I applaud Sean's efforts and it all really boils down to the individual buyer or seller to ensure they have done everything THEY can do before dealing with buyers and sellers.

logan2z · Jul 18, 2022

Eric Rose said:
Bad guys will be bad guys. It's almost impossible to stop them.

Unfortunately true.

I mentioned this in another thread on a similar issue and it's something that can really help prevent getting scammed by someone posting FS or answering WTB ads:

Request a photo of the item being offered that includes a written note containing the member's forum name and current date. This won't guarantee that you won't get scammed, but at least it tells you that the seller actually has the item in his possession.

Bronson Dugnutt · Jul 18, 2022

logan2z said:
Request a photo of the item being offered that includes a written note containing the member's forum name and current date. This won't guarantee that you won't get scammed, but at least it tells you that the seller actually has the item in his possession.

This. It's as close as you can get to a Diablo-style trading window here in meatspace, short of using an escrow.

Ultimately caveat emptor rules the day.

It's an interesting and long standing problem from a game theory perspective.

Sirius Glass · Jul 18, 2022

It is hard to stop the bad guys, but if this stops even one then it is worth it.

MattKing · Jul 18, 2022

We actually have had situations where people with entirely good intentions have made "filler" posts in order to initiate a private Conversation. There are people out there who joined a long time ago who don't post much!
There is no absolutely foolproof way of identifying scammers before they scam.
But it really does help when the community is diligent, and reports their suspicions. So thank you again to those who do.

DWThomas · Jul 18, 2022

Not sure what's here currently, but some forums limit new members to a few posts per day in addition to these other checks. A limit of say, 4 or 5 would also restrain robot-like attempts to jump to 20 posts in one fell swoop -- or swell foop.

AgX · Jul 18, 2022

MattKing said:
We actually have had situations where people with entirely good intentions have made "filler" posts in order to initiate a private Conversation. There are people out there who joined a long time ago who don't post much!

But filler-posts are still spam and annoying. And a new member can at the respective thread raise his issue, even quote the person he is looking to communicate with and indicate that he likes to be contacted on this issue.

I mean, we are a forum, anyone participating thus should be willing and able to bring himself in.
Those who see Photrio as a market place instead are to my understanding at the wrong ground.

MattKing · Jul 18, 2022

AgX said:
But filler-posts are still spam and annoying.

Not necessarily. Posts welcoming someone to Photrio, expressing appreciation for a posted photo, adding a joke in the joke thread, identifying a camera seen in an old movie ( ) all those sort of posts have their place too.

Sean · Jul 18, 2022

DWThomas said:
Not sure what's here currently, but some forums limit new members to a few posts per day in addition to these other checks. A limit of say, 4 or 5 would also restrain robot-like attempts to jump to 20 posts in one fell swoop -- or swell foop.

This is coming soon, new accounts will have a throttle until they hit 20 posts, maybe 3-5 per day max at first.

Michael Howard · Jul 18, 2022

As a long time member, but very infrequent poster, I'm not even sure I'm up to 20 posts yet. I have bought a couple of items here over time though. Never been solicited. I think the new rules coming in are a good start, and may very well end up being pretty much all you can do, without going overboard.
Consider this a filler post lol, gotta make sure I'm over 20 in case someone puts up a nice Konica something-or-other.

AgX · Jul 18, 2022

To me a filler post in this context is when someone posts things as "great", "lol", "I like it", when such does not make sense with the preceeding postings in mind. Or when someone just posts a full-stop as in the latest case.

Micheal,
You can see your current number postings at your short-profile just left of any posting of yours. There they are callrd "messages" now.
At the moment your count is at 33.

B+WFriend · Aug 2, 2022

I’ve been an Apug member for a long time but haven’t been active in a number of years and am getting back to serious photography again. I can’t figure out all the new changes to the posting/reply/direct messaging stuff. It’s a little frustrating but I’m sure all in good faith the keep the forums safe.

B+WFriend · Aug 2, 2022

I have an interesting problem related to this. It seems like I cannot post to certain threads nor direct message. I’ve been a light user for many years and I can’t even post to threads where I have posted in the past. Any way to get these privileges back…? Thanks.

nmp · Aug 2, 2022

Sean said:
I've updated this part of the new member notice to indicate this:

"will not be available until you have posted at least 20 (genuine, not filler) messages"...

How are you going to monitor the genuineness of the posts. Perhaps community can help by giving thumbs up for a new member posts - though I realize the site does not have the "thumbs up" capability. May be nice to have that. If you have that, may be require a new poster to acquire 10 thumbs up or something to come out of probation and be free to do trading.

:Niranjan.

Fyi- Slight modification to new members access in order to prevent classifieds scamming.

Sean

Admin

AgX

Sean

Admin

Nitroplait

AgX

Nitroplait

Don_ih

ic-racer

juan

mtnbkr

FotoD

Eric Rose

logan2z

Bronson Dugnutt

Sirius Glass

MattKing

Moderator

DWThomas

AgX

MattKing

Moderator

Sean

Admin

Michael Howard

AgX

B+WFriend

B+WFriend

nmp

Fyi- Slight modification to new members access in order to prevent classifieds scamming.

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