Digital Negatives by Reeder/Hinkel

donbga · Dec 19, 2006

Okay I received the book last week and read through the calibration chapters. Today I received an order of Pictorico White Film and plan to begin a calibration series on RC B&W paper printing negatives with an Epson 2200 with MK ink.

What concerns me at this point is the possibility of the dithering problem reported by M. Schulte when using the Windows version of QTR. Has anyone else experienced this problem?

Having previous experience with QTR Curve Creator is a plus and I would expect that a starting ink limit of 25 to 30% would be adequate.

If the dithering problem does appear I have a Linux server setup that I can use for QTR operations though I've never used that flavor of QTR. I don't have a Samba share setup so I suppose I'll simply connect the printer directly to the Linux box.

Any advice from anyone with the Linux - QTR package will be appreciated.

BTW, I think Ron and Brad have produced a well written book. I do wish that there was a mechanism to plot more than 10 data points for curve building but you go to war with the Army you've got.

Merry Christmas,

Don Bryant

mprosenberg · Dec 19, 2006

Don,

What was the problem with the dither pattern you used? I used the ordered pattern for my digital negatives on my 2400, and it seemed fine. In fact, I am not sure that the 2400 is capable of anything other than dither pattern.

Steve Billard has tweaked some of the gui bugs I had encountered recently and it is now up to version 2.4.3.17. You may want to download that version.

Mike

donbga · Dec 19, 2006

Michael P. Rosenberg said:
Don,

What was the problem with the dither pattern you used? I used the ordered pattern for my digital negatives on my 2400, and it seemed fine. In fact, I am not sure that the 2400 is capable of anything other than dither pattern.

Steve Billard has tweaked some of the gui bugs I had encountered recently and it is now up to version 2.4.3.17. You may want to download that version.

Mike

Mike,

My question was in regard to this post by M. Schulte:

http://www.hybridphoto.com/forums/showthread.php?p=642#poststop

I've not started printing anything yet, but thanks for answering my post. I'm sure I will have more questions as I move forward. I'm just preparing to do some printing during the holidays. I have a backlog of things to print and I wanted to get started making QTR negs without wasting time and materials.

Best,

Don Bryant

mkochsch · Dec 20, 2006

Don Bryant said:
Okay I received the book last week and read through the calibration chapters. Today I received an order of Pictorico White Film and plan to begin a calibration series on RC B&W paper printing negatives with an Epson 2200 with MK ink.

What concerns me at this point is the possibility of the dithering problem reported by M. Schulte when using the Windows version of QTR. Has anyone else experienced this problem?

Having previous experience with QTR Curve Creator is a plus and I would expect that a starting ink limit of 25 to 30% would be adequate.

If the dithering problem does appear I have a Linux server setup that I can use for QTR operations though I've never used that flavor of QTR. I don't have a Samba share setup so I suppose I'll simply connect the printer directly to the Linux box.

Any advice from anyone with the Linux - QTR package will be appreciated.

BTW, I think Ron and Brad have produced a well written book. I do wish that there was a mechanism to plot more than 10 data points for curve building but you go to war with the Army you've got.

Merry Christmas,

Don Bryant

Don,
Here are some scans of the transparency tests I made. Forgive the dust specks they've been in a drawer for the last couple of weeks.
They clearly show the pattern I was talking about. This was with Ink limits set down to 26%, no Black channel was used, on an Epson R300, using QTR's best resolution settings. I also tried a different dither (this one is "Ordered") and the results were about the same.
I may take another run at it. I had a calibration problem that had come to light after abandoning QTR which may have played a part in my initial problems.
Also, I'm rethinking the whole "no black" thing. Is it really a big deal to use a small amount of black? To create a particular hue dots must overlap. Black is just another dot in the mix when it comes down to it. I'm using dye-based inks so maybe it's not as big an issue as the "pigmented" ink sets.

regards,
Michael

mprosenberg · Dec 20, 2006

Don and Michael,

I am using QTR on the PC, using all the inks but LLK as Ron and Brad recommended on their web site. I am using ordered dither. The negatives are printed on OHP, new OHP, and white film, using the 2400. I do not see the fine bands shown, but I do see bands about 1/8-1/4 inches apart. The bands are subtle, and are not visible in image negatives except in areas of light tonalities. I see the same bands using the Epson driver. So I think this is something inherent to the printer head. Having said that, in images that do not have continuous tonalities I cannot see the bands.

I would love to see what the 3800 with the improved printer head can produce. I am hoping that they carry the new head technology over to the 7800 soon - then I will have to break open the piggy bank.

Mike

mkochsch · Dec 20, 2006

Michael P. Rosenberg said:
Don and Michael,

I am using QTR on the PC, using all the inks but LLK as Ron and Brad recommended on their web site. I am using ordered dither. The negatives are printed on OHP, new OHP, and white film, using the 2400. I do not see the fine bands shown, but I do see bands about 1/8-1/4 inches apart. The bands are subtle, and are not visible in image negatives except in areas of light tonalities. I see the same bands using the Epson driver. So I think this is something inherent to the printer head. Having said that, in images that do not have continuous tonalities I cannot see the bands.

I would love to see what the 3800 with the improved printer head can produce. I am hoping that they carry the new head technology over to the 7800 soon - then I will have to break open the piggy bank.

Mike

To compare my results obtained using the epson driver in All Black mode. Notice the lines are completely gone. Mind you the driver is also firing on all cylinders too. Is this the problem? I'll run some more tests with the QTR shortly and find out. The QTR seems to not have the Super Microweave setting, or the ability to go above 2880...whereas the Epson driver does have these settings (5760 DPI).
One thing to note is that these are greyscale scans of a colourised negative. Note on the closeup is taken right on the border of 59 and 60 per cent. The black dots are very easy to see "kicking in" at this point, both of the smooth scale and the step scale.

donbga · Dec 20, 2006

mkochsch said:
To compare my results obtained using the epson driver in All Black mode. Notice the lines are completely gone. Mind you the driver is also firing on all cylinders too. Is this the problem? I'll run some more tests with the QTR shortly and find out. The QTR seems to not have the Super Microweave setting, or the ability to go above 2880...whereas the Epson driver does have these settings (5760 DPI).
One thing to note is that these are greyscale scans of a colourised negative. Note on the closeup is taken right on the border of 59 and 60 per cent. The black dots are very easy to see "kicking in" at this point, both of the smooth scale and the step scale.

Hi Michael,

I think you may have hit upon the problem with your particular printer. In the next day or so I'll test my 2200 and let you know my results.

Don Bryant

Digital Negatives by Reeder/Hinkel

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