Another Agfa paper rumor -- confirm, anybody?

[Rolleiflexible]

I just saw this exchange over on the large format site:

http://www.largeformatphotography.info/forum/showthread.php?t=21814

Is anyone here in a position to confirm or deny or explain?

Sanders McNew

 

[Fotohuis]

There are negotiations going on between some investors, Rollei/Maco and some third parties ) ) to have a restart of the production unit for Agfa MCP/MCC. If this is a continuation in France, it is not sure at all. Further I have no direct information available.

 

[Rolleiflexible]

Robert, that smilie is intriguing. Are any participants in this thread part of the negotiations? Sanders

 

[Fotohuis]

http://www.aphog.de/forum/viewtopic.php?t=539

Further without any comment on this subject. For such a financial injection you need some real money of course.

Best regards,

Robert

 

[Rolleiflexible]

Rats. I tried to read the linked thread but the site denied me access. And my German isn't all it could be. :-(

Real money ... there might be some of us out here willing to invest in the cause, if the result is fresh MCC 111 ....

Sanders.

 

[Photo Engineer]

You might all consider the fact that the majority of the old Agfa equipment was auctioned off, and went to a number of different bidders. Therefore, with this degree of fragmentation, it seems to me it would be hard for anyone to replicate Agfa products without considerable investment in the missing pieces.

PE

 

[markrewald]

oh Great the French taking over production of Afga? Between their 12 months of vacation and national holidays when will they get around to it? =)

 

[Petzi]

oh Great the French taking over production of Afga? Between their 12 months of vacation and national holidays when will they get around to it? =)

There is no coating plant in France, all they ever did in France was cut and box Agfa paper.

 

[Fotohuis]

Between their 12 months of vacation and national holidays.....

I think we have to move ....... to

 

[Rolleiflexible]

oh Great the French taking over production of Afga? Between their 12 months of vacation and national holidays when will they get around to it? =)

Sadly, given the shrunken demand for B+W photographic papers, the French calendar might afford an optimal runtime for a modern paper coating facility.

Sanders

 

[Fotohuis]

Sadly, given the shrunken demand for B+W photographic papers, the French calendar might afford an optimal runtime for a modern paper coating facility.

Shall I put a link/connection to the APUG French forum? Maybe there will be some more response in a short time.

 

[acroell]

There is no coating plant in France, all they ever did in France was cut and box Agfa paper.

The Gevaert plant the original post was referring to is in Mortsel, Belgium, and makes materials for medical and printing applications.

 

[PHOTOTONE]

The Gevaert plant the original post was referring to is in Mortsel, Belgium, and makes materials for medical and printing applications.

That Gevaert plant used to coat common b/w film. Back when I was a child in the 1960's, my dad purchased for me a whole box full of 120 Gevaert b/w film, which, as I remember our local discount store had for $0.19 cents per roll.

 

[ADOX Fotoimpex]

MCC/MCP

We are involved in this venture of revitalising what used to be Agfa products since August, yet at this point it is too early to make any type of an announcement.
I wonder actually who spread this word at this stage as it is way too early to do when you have not even ripened all emulsions fully.
All I can confirm is that the above named companies are at this stage not involved neither financally nor with knowledge or support.
One of them has announced interest in buying the readymade paper last week. That´s it for them.

I hope that this venture will be succesfull and will surely communicate more details as soon as they become available.

Where the paper will be coated has yet to be determined. At this point the emulsionists are working on the emulsions only and use small lab test coaters.
The grain structure looks promising, that is all we can say at this point.
More details will hoepfully become available around february 2007.

Regards and merry Christmas to everyone,

Mirko

ADOX FOTOIMPEX

 

[Ian Grant]

A most useful reply, lets wait and see what happens. Meanwhiole good luck.

Ian

 

[Bob Carnie]

Good luck Mirko this is hopeful sign

We are involved in this venture of revitalising what used to be Agfa products since August, yet at this point it is too early to make any type of an announcement.
I wonder actually who spread this word at this stage as it is way too early to do when you have not even ripened all emulsions fully.
All I can confirm is that the above named companies are at this stage not involved neither financally nor with knowledge or support.
One of them has announced interest in buying the readymade paper last week. That´s it for them.

I hope that this venture will be succesfull and will surely communicate more details as soon as they become available.

Where the paper will be coated has yet to be determined. At this point the emulsionists are working on the emulsions only and use small lab test coaters.
The grain structure looks promising, that is all we can say at this point.
More details will hoepfully become available around february 2007.

Regards and merry Christmas to everyone,

Mirko

ADOX FOTOIMPEX

 

[Jim Chinn]

Wow. If "revitalizing" means using the original Agfa recipes/emulsions for paper, that would be incredible news for a lot of printers.

 

[ADOX Fotoimpex]

Dear Jim,

yes this it what it means.....BUT in photo emulsioning it is not only the recipe but also the kitchen that is important and it (the kitchen) needs to be operated constantly.
Even Agfa itself was not able to reproduce the last APX production run which took place in early 2004 on their very own identical equipment in late 2005 after a break of only 1,5 years.
The film came out differently and needed to be touched up with the emulsionists "magic stick" (please spare me the details now) but this is why the last batches out now differ from the ones dated 2006 and 2007.
If it is better or worse depends on the vote of the consumers. Sofar they are happy but the scientists have measured slightly substandard values even after touch up.

The old Agfa kettle to make APX for example took 1000 Liters and was built in 1965. This kettle has repair patches over and over, smells bad and is history now.

What we are trying to do is running original recipes but on new, much smaller gear built in 2002-2004.
The machines used are from the former agfa research departement which are basically a copy of the original larger machinery on miniature scale (40 liters).
Yet even these kettles can produce per anno enough emulsion for hundreds of thousands of films or tens of thousands of sqm of paper if they run day and night.

The new equipment is fully computer controled and infrared equipped and if we manage to run the emulsions on this we have achieved what we aim for: micro scale production of highest quality films with most modern technology available at workable prices to ensure the availability of fine b/w products for many many years to come.

Will it be similar to the original ? Answer: Yes.
Will it be 100% like the original ? Answer: Most likely no.
Can it be better than the original: yes !

Last question: When will it be available ?
Answer: I really can´t say.

We did not want to communicate this too early because this really is an ambitious project and there are many challenges to face still but since it is impossible to keep it totally secret and before rumours cause more harm then good I decided to publish this today.
We almost have everything we need. Now we need time and a little bit of luck.

Regards,

Mirko

ADOX

 

[SuzanneR]

Well... a bit "Good Luck To You" then.

Very encouraging news, I would love to use Agfa paper again. Thanks for posting.

 

[jovo]

The machines used are from the former agfa research departement which are basically a copy of the original larger machinery on miniature scale (40 liters).
Yet even these kettles can produce per anno enough emulsion for hundreds of thousands of films or tens of thousands of sqm of paper if they run day and night.

The new equipment is fully computer controled and infrared equipped and if we manage to run the emulsions on this we have achieved what we aim for: micro scale production of highest quality films with most modern technology available at workable prices to ensure the availability of fine b/w products for many many years to come.

Should this all come to pass, you shall have given a lot of people here a wonderful Christmas present!! Best wishes, and good luck!!

 

[Jim Chinn]

Mirko,

I still say wow! Good luck on this endeavor. Another option for materials will be very welcome. Thanks.

 

[Rolleiflexible]

Mirko, that's the best news I've heard in a long time. If I can be a resource for you in any way, please tell me.

Best,

Sanders McNew

 

[catem]

This is really good news. Just this week I was looking at some old prints on Agfa Classic and wishing it was still around (one of them my avatar in fact!). It's also very encouraging that in some ways the pendulum seems to be swinging back to some degree at least (maybe it will swing even further) and traditional photography seems to be certain of a niche way into the future.

To all producers and potential producers of trad. photographic materials: We are here in numbers!! Be sure of it, WE WILL BUY !!

Cate

 

[David A. Goldfarb]

Wow, this is interesting!

Portriga. The old Portriga. Graded. That would be something.

 

[keeds]

Never really used many Agfa products (apart from Rodinal) but this is fantastic news and shows that there is still plenty of drive, determination and hopefully demand to keep B&W products going and improving...