Ammonium carbonate - is this the salt used in baking as well?

[ymc226]

I am having a great time beginning to lith print using Wolfgang Moersch's SE5 lith kit but want to have a deeper black without having the midtones proceed into infectious development and darken as well.

On Freestyle's website, the Moersch Part Omega seems that it will allow me to do this by stopping development and then intensifying the highlights and deepen the shadows without affecting the midtones. They have only one bottle left so while I wait for more . . .

The part Omega from the MDS sheet seems to be a 30% solution of ammonium carbonate but I can't find ammonium carbonate on either Photographers Formulary, Artcraft Chemicals or Tech Chem Inc. Googling Ammonium carbonate, it states that it is simply smelling salt that can be used in baking. Can I just buy the food grade product to use in lith printing, mixing up a 30% solution?

 

[Jürgen]

I'm not sure I would bake a cake with it. The ammonium ion is a weak acid and the carbonate ion is a base. When dissolved in water I would expect the that you would get ammonia gas, carbon dioxide and water. The result would be an alkaline solution. I don't understand the chemistry that is going on since I don't do lith printing. I suppose that you could mix sodium carbonate and ammonium chloride to get the same ions in solution.

Jurgen

 

[Galah]

... I can't find ammonium carbonate on either Photographers Formulary, Artcraft Chemicals or Tech Chem Inc. Googling Ammonium carbonate, it states that it is simply smelling salt that can be used in baking. Can I just buy the food grade product to use in lith printing, mixing up a 30% solution?

I think someone's made an error: using Ammonium Carbonate in baking would drive everyone out of the kitchen/bakery!

The ingredient used in baking is Sodium Carbonate (or "Baking Soda")

The "limestone" in rocks (as in landscape) is Calcium Carbonate.

In chemistry, "words" matter, and substituting one thing for another could result in considerable grief.

 

[Galah]

...The ammonium ion is a weak acid ..and the carbonate ion is a base...Jurgen

The reverse, actually.

(Another casualty of modern education?)

 

[semeuse]

Yes you can get the ammonium carbonate food grade. It is known as "baker's ammonia" - a great way to make thin crispy cookies. It was very common before the advent of baking soda (sodium bicarbonate) and baking powder (sodium bicarbonate with some other goodies added - some kind of phosphate I think). An excellent source is King Arthur Flour Company: http://www.kingarthurflour.com/shop/items/bakers-ammonia-ammonium-carbonate-27-oz

 

[lxdude]

I think someone's made an error: using Ammonium Carbonate in baking would drive everyone out of the kitchen/bakery!

The ingredient used in baking is Sodium Carbonate (or "Baking Soda")

The "limestone" in rocks (as in landscape) is Calcium Carbonate.

In chemistry, "words" matter, and substituting one thing for another could result in considerable grief.

Ammonium carbonate is also known as Baking Ammonia, or Baker's Ammonia. It has a strong odor and is an irritant until baked, the heat of which will drive it off. There should be good ventilation while preparing batter or dough. It's not used as much as it used to be, but is still considered unsurpassed for making things like cookies light and crispy.

The OP can find it at baking supply houses.

 

[lxdude]

The reverse, actually.

(Another casualty of modern education?)

Nope. It's ammonium, not ammonia. And carbonate is basic.

 

[ymc226]

Thanks for all of your responses. I will use ammonium carbonate but have a few questions on how to do this. The Moersch MDS states that the Omega lith component is a 30% solution.

1. I just wanted to confirm that a 30% solution would be 30gm diluted to make a 100ml solution?
2. Given that it is an irritant, I would mix it outdoors once the weather warms up. Is it OK to mix it with hot tap water to make it easier to dissolve or will it change its chemical activity with the heat (I am NOT a chemist, obviously)
3. the Moersch Omega product comes in a bottle that has what I understand is a built in dropper with a stopper cap that prevents the irritating fumes from escaping. Is there anything similar from any of the chemical supply shops that I can purchase?
4. how stable would be the dissolved solution? Just ballpark estimates would suffice. ?months or years.