actual negative dimensions

Discussion in 'Medium Format Cameras and Accessories' started by alanrockwood, Apr 25, 2010.

  1. alanrockwood

    alanrockwood Member

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    What are the actual dimensions of 6x4.5 negatives?

    I also wonder what the actual dimensions are for 6x6 format and 4x5 format.

    Thanks.

    Alan
     
  2. sandholm

    sandholm Member

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    I can agree that its a big confusing,

    6x4.5 is 6 cm times 4.5 cm,
    6x6 is 6 cm times 6 cm (aka the Hasselblad format)
    4x5 is in inches, so 10x13 cm

    some more info about the different formats
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Film_format
     
  3. hidesert

    hidesert Member

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    The exposed area of my Rolleiflex TLR's negatives measures 56mm x 56mm.
     
  4. keithwms

    keithwms Member

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    645 does not mean that the image sizes on the film are actually 6 cm by 4.5 cm. The aspect ratio is consistent and the actual image sizes are close, but they are always a few mm shorter than the stated format size, on both sides of the image area. And there is also some minor variation in actual image size from brand to brand. For example, on my mamiya 645, the corners are clipped a bit so that the usable, rectangular image area is quite a few mm short of 6x4.5 cm. I have used other 645s that have no edge clipping.
     
  5. brianmquinn

    brianmquinn Member

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  6. lxdude

    lxdude Member

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    On medium format, actual is smaller than nominal.

    For example, Bronica gives 645 as 42.5 X 55.1, 6X6 as 55.6 X 55.6, and 6X7 as 55.6 X 69.0
     
  7. jnanian

    jnanian Advertiser Advertiser

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    4x5 film is NOT 4"x5" ...
    that was the size of the PLATE when
    dry plates were sold.
    when sheet film began to be sold
    little metal septums were sold
    to convert plate holders to sheet film holders.
    film was about 1/16 smaller than the plate to fit in the holder ...

    when plates stopped being popular, and film became king
    it was still sold the same size... and photographers didn't have
    to dump all the old film/plate holders to buy new different sized ones ...

    this goes for other sheet film sizes too.
     
  8. The Hasselblad 6x6 is actually 56 mm by 56 mm.

    Steve
     
  9. 2F/2F

    2F/2F Member

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    The exact size depends on the camera, though 56 mm in width seems fairly common. I never really had much of a reason to know, so I have never measured. Why do you want to know?
     
  10. Ian C

    Ian C Member

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    Image Rectangle Dimensions

    There is always some confusion in the actual dimensions of the image rectangle. Obviously a 2 ¼”-wide film can’t have a 2 ¼ “x 2 ¼” image due to the necessity of the film width overlapping the film aperture—the “window” in the camera or film holder. The film aperture can vary slightly from maker to maker.

    The Wikipedia page is useful, but doesn’t really give the actual dimensions of the image rectangle. Actual sizes vary due to variations in the dimensions of the film aperture chosen by each maker. Usually they’re about:

    56mm x 42mm (nominally 6cm x 4.5 cm)

    56mm x 56mm (nominally 6cm x 6cm)

    56mm x 69.5mm (nominally 6cm x 7cm)

    This link provides more comments, particularly on the variations in the length of the 6 x 7cm format:

    http://www.kenrockwell.com/tech/format.htm

    Mamiya always specified the dimension of the image rectangle for its MF cameras in its advertising literature. It specifies 56mm x 69.5mm for its 6 x 7 cm cameras. I believe that 56mm is the dimension across the width of 120 and 220 films for all Mamiya MF cameras.

    A similar situation exists for sheet film holders. Further, they produce a wider image where the hold-down rails are cut out for film loading.

    The most accurate way to determine the dimension is to simply measure the film aperture of your camera or film holder.
     
  11. What and loose an opportunity to post on APUG!

    Steve
     
  12. sandholm

    sandholm Member

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    well, it come down to what you define as "negatives" area, for me the negative is the film size, then you have an exposed area on the negative, but that come down the the camera and system...

    same same but different :wink:
     
  13. Dan Daniel

    Dan Daniel Subscriber

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    The manual for a Bronica ETR 645 camera has the following info:

    FRAME SIZE: 42.5mm x 55.1mm

    They state the ratio as 1:1.29, not the 1:1.33 a true 4.5:6 would be.
     
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  15. Ray Rapkerg

    Ray Rapkerg Member

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    I measured my negs to see what the actual image sizes really are:

    35mm (Leica M3): 36mm x 24mm

    Medium format 6x4.5 (Pentax 645nII): 56mm x 41mm (2.66x the area of 35mm)

    Medium format 6x6 (Rolleiflex 6008af): 56mm x 56mm (3.63x the area of 35mm)

    Medium format 6x8 (Fujifilm GX680III): 76mm x 55mm (4.84x the area of 35mm)

    Large format 5"x4" (Fidelity film holder): 120mm x 96mm (13.33x the area of 35mm)

    Large format 10"x8" (Fidelity film holder): 246mm x 195mm (55.52x the area of 35mm)
     
  16. Tony-S

    Tony-S Member

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    Wow, zombie thread...
     
  17. macfred

    macfred Subscriber

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    Raised from the dead ... [​IMG]
     
  18. ic-racer

    ic-racer Member

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    Best way to find out is to measure the image dimensions of your negatives. Each camera, film holder and film back will be slightly different.
     
  19. moto-uno

    moto-uno Subscriber

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    And if you want to be surprised , try a Fujica Gl690 , the actual neg barely makes it to 82mm , Oh well I'm over it :smile: . Peter
     
  20. Ray Rapkerg

    Ray Rapkerg Member

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    We can see that on 120 film, the neg is between 55mm and 56mm wide across the film (depending on camera brand). Most are close to 56mm, i.e. 4mm less than the official size. In terms of length along the film, all my cameras are 4mm less than the official size. For instance my 6x4.5 is 41mm, and my 6x6 is 56mm. So a simple rule of thumb for 120 formats is deduct 4mm from both dimensions. (Except for some rare ones such as moto-uno's Fujica which is 8mm less along the length.)
     
  21. Dan Fromm

    Dan Fromm Member

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    Another failed induction.

    6x9, anyone? 6x9 (some badged 2 1/4 x 3 1/4 or 2x3 or 23) roll holders' gate lengths range from 78 - 84 mm. 6x12 anyone? All 6x12 roll holders but Linhof's are 56 x 112. Linhof's is 6 x 120.
     
  22. E. von Hoegh

    E. von Hoegh Member

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    Linhof Super Rollex, 56mm x 72mm, "Ideal Format".
     
  23. PittP

    PittP Member

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    If I recall right, same for fuji 680.
    The 6x7 format of Mamiya and Plaubel is 56 x 69 to 56 x 70 - so insignificantly smaller than 6x8.
    It also means that 6x8 transparencies can go in 6x7 frames, the loss on the sides should normally be insignificant to the picture.
     
  24. Barry Kirsten

    Barry Kirsten Subscriber

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    Yet another rusurrection of this thread,,, I can't believe the variation in 'standard' sizes. I'm just checking my 6x9 negs to see if I have a suitable mask for my enlarger. I do have a mask amongst my Durst bits and pieces, but I find its for 21/4x 31/4 cut film, which is OK because I use this film sometimes, but it's too small for 6x9 negs without losing image area. I find my old 6x9s done with a Super Rollex back on a Linhof I used to have measure 88x58 mm, whereas my Horseman 6x9 negs are actually 83x56 in negative area. Good job I checked. I'll make a mask for the larger size and make it do for all my 6x9 printing.
     
  25. Jim Jones

    Jim Jones Subscriber

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    To add to the confusion, wide angle lenses produce slightly larger image dimensions in most cameras.
     
  26. paul ron

    paul ron Subscriber

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    Arista EDU 4x5
    4x5 film in inches is actually 4 13/16" x 3 7/8" (100mm x125mm)

    the image area on my Wista is 3 3/4" x 4 14/16" (119mm x 95mm)